Karen Koehler – What Horses Have to Say About Death
An End-of-Life Doula for all animals, speaks about her journey with helping horses as they prepare for death. By preparing the horse for what is coming and how it will be, it allows others in the herd to say goodbye and for the horse to leave with peace and calm. Hear the stories of helping horses transition from this world to the next with Karen Koehler, who is a Pet Loss Grief specialist and animal chaplain. This podcast deals with the reality of death in a sweet, gentle, and poignant way that helps humans and their horses be better prepared for the change of life.
Listen to Episode #41 Now:
BIO:
Transcript:
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Announcer: This is Pet Life Radio.
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Announcer: Let's talk pets.
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Announcer: Welcome to The Human-Animal Connection Show, where we believe we can communicate with all animals.
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Announcer: Join us as we explore the 33 principles and healing methods of The Human-Animal Connection.
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Announcer: As animal lovers, we know that you share our commitment to making the world a kinder place for all creatures.
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Announcer: Together, let's embrace the transformative healing power of The Human-Animal Connection.
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Genie Joseph: Hi, everyone.
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Genie Joseph: It's Genie Joseph from The Human-Animal Connection.
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Genie Joseph: So glad you're with us today.
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Genie Joseph: And I have a wonderful guest that I've been looking forward to speaking to, Karen Koehler.
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Genie Joseph: And she has just an amazing history.
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Genie Joseph: She is a somatic experiencing practitioner.
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Genie Joseph: She's a pet loss grief specialist.
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Genie Joseph: She is an end-of-life doula for all animals.
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Genie Joseph: She's an animal chaplain, and she's an interspecies communicator.
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Genie Joseph: And if that wasn't enough, she also has touch skills and reiki for horses.
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Genie Joseph: And today we're going to focus on what she's learned about animal souls through the process of witnessing, the process of preparing for death, death and dying in horses.
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Genie Joseph: So we're going to find out what the horses have taught her about death and dying.
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Genie Joseph: So Karen, thank you so much for being with us today.
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Karen Koehler: Oh, Genie, my pleasure.
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Karen Koehler: Thank you so much for inviting me.
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Genie Joseph: Yeah.
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Genie Joseph: Well, let's start by, you know, a lot of people believe that animals have souls.
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Genie Joseph: Some people are not quite sure.
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Genie Joseph: Some people are very hopeful.
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Genie Joseph: What have you learned in your work with animals about the fact that animals have souls?
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Genie Joseph: We'll start with that.
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Genie Joseph: I'll call it a fact, and then tell us how you know it to be true.
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Karen Koehler: Yeah, well, I've had a lot of experiences throughout my life, but it never really told me about animals.
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Karen Koehler: It told me more about humans.
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Karen Koehler: And then all of a sudden, I was living in Korea.
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Karen Koehler: I was married to someone in the military at the time, and we had left our cat in Arizona while we were in Korea for a year.
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Karen Koehler: And all of a sudden one night, I awoke feeling a cat kneading on my back.
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Karen Koehler: And I just sat up, and I said, Meshach has come to say goodbye.
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Karen Koehler: She died, and she's come to say goodbye.
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Karen Koehler: And he came from a very strict religious background, and so did not agree with what I was saying.
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Karen Koehler: But it gave me such a sense of peace to know that she could find me anywhere, and that there was this connection.
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Karen Koehler: And we did get a letter a week later to say she had indeed disappeared that night.
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Karen Koehler: So we think it was probably coyotes, but it set me on the path of, okay, I've known this for humans, now I know it for animals.
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Genie Joseph: Wow, wow.
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Genie Joseph: And I know you've done a lot of work with horses and death and dying, helping horses understand what's happening and finding out from them how they feel.
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Genie Joseph: Can you tell us some of the stories where you've learned something from a horse about their perception of death and dying?
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Karen Koehler: It's been amazing.
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Karen Koehler: I used to volunteer at a horse rescue, and I found out that one horse was going to be put down, and this was my first experience with it there.
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Karen Koehler: And so I decided to just go visit him, and it was late in the afternoon, and it was an old horse, and I knew he was ready.
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Karen Koehler: I could feel that, but I just wanted to go speak to him.
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Karen Koehler: And so I walked up to him, and I'm just looking in his eyes and telling him, I know you're going to die tomorrow, you know, and I'm so sorry.
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Karen Koehler: And he's just looking at me.
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Karen Koehler: And all of a sudden, I just started singing, You Must Have Been a Beautiful Baby.
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Karen Koehler: Because I had no history on him.
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Karen Koehler: You know, often in rescue, we don't have a history.
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Karen Koehler: But I just wanted to honor the fact that he was magnificent and that he had a childhood.
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Karen Koehler: He had a mother who loved him.
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Karen Koehler: And that we were there for him now.
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Karen Koehler: Yeah.
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Karen Koehler: Another time, there was this young horse that was going to be euthanized the next day.
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Karen Koehler: And I had asked, has anyone told him?
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Karen Koehler: Because I really believed that they deserved to know.
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Genie Joseph: Yes.
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Karen Koehler: You know, and so I went out to talk to him and tell him.
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Karen Koehler: And immediately, he went.
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Karen Koehler: You can see the fear in his eyes.
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Karen Koehler: And he went and ran behind another horse.
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Karen Koehler: So I asked this horse if he would talk to him.
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Karen Koehler: You know, I explained the procedure and everything.
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Karen Koehler: I said, but you need to be able to tell him that.
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Karen Koehler: He doesn't need to hear it from me right now.
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Karen Koehler: That's too scary for him.
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Karen Koehler: And so actually, it was a week earlier.
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Karen Koehler: I told him a week earlier.
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Karen Koehler: And so you had that whole week to get to the point of incorporating that into who he was within the herd, to be able to hear their stories and share their stories, share his story, and have a farewell process with them.
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Karen Koehler: When the time came, when they had to lead him out, he was just so peaceful.
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Karen Koehler: Yeah.
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Genie Joseph: Yeah, it's an extraordinary thing.
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Genie Joseph: You know, a lot of, I don't think that everybody tells their horse that this is what's going to happen, you know, and I think that they deserve to know.
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Genie Joseph: If they don't already, they deserve to know.
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Genie Joseph: And the notion of being able to pass peacefully is, I think, humans owe that to the animals that are in their lives and to find out how can I contribute to the peace.
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Genie Joseph: And one way is through letting them know, and another way is through giving them time to process.
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Genie Joseph: What else have you noticed about making that process more peaceful?
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Karen Koehler: Well, there was another horse who, they had brought him up to his feed stall so that they didn't have to get him at the last moment.
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Karen Koehler: So they brought him up to the feed stall, and again, I said, has anyone told him?
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Karen Koehler: And they hadn't, so I went out there and told the horse, but then also announced it to the herd, because the herd needed time to say goodbye.
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Karen Koehler: And so all of a sudden, you'd see horses starting to come up to the feed stall.
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Karen Koehler: It's almost like there was a procession.
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Karen Koehler: They had a little bit of time with him, and then they left.
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Karen Koehler: And if you didn't know what was going on, you just think, oh, they're just going up to see if there's extra hay on the ground or something.
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Karen Koehler: But it just felt so sacred.
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Karen Koehler: Yeah, yeah.
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Karen Koehler: Another time, there was a mother and daughter, two mares, that were in separate pastures.
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Karen Koehler: And I had asked if they could be reunited just right before the euthanasia of the mother.
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Karen Koehler: And for some reason, it couldn't happen.
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Karen Koehler: So I talked to the mother, and she was able to say goodbye to some of the others in her pasture.
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Karen Koehler: And I told her I would talk to her daughter afterwards.
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Karen Koehler: And so I was able to bring some of her tail into the daughter's pasture.
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Karen Koehler: And this is a hard one.
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Karen Koehler: And so I brought it out to the daughter, and she just buried her head into this piece of tail that I had in my hand.
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Karen Koehler: And she breathes so deeply.
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Karen Koehler: She knew it was her mother.
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Karen Koehler: And all of a sudden, almost like this whale came out of her, cried, and all of her friends started to surround her.
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Karen Koehler: And I just stayed there as long as she needed me.
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Karen Koehler: And she kept coming back and breathing it in and just coming back.
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Karen Koehler: And it was just beautiful.
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Karen Koehler: It was heartbreaking.
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Genie Joseph: Heartbreaking.
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Genie Joseph: Yeah, of course.
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Karen Koehler: But it was just, you know, just to see there's so much we don't know.
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Karen Koehler: It doesn't take much just to go and honor relationship, honor their lives, honor their ability to tell their story.
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Genie Joseph: Yes.
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Genie Joseph: And especially in a herd environment, it's not just affecting the one who's passing, but everyone that has connection to that horse.
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Genie Joseph: So to recognize that horses do have herd consciousness, you know, they have a sense of what's going on with everyone in the herd and like that.
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Genie Joseph: And in your experience, the horses that were in, there were appointments for euthanasia that the horses knew or didn't know.
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Genie Joseph: What have you noticed about that?
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Karen Koehler: Usually, they didn't know.
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Karen Koehler: They knew something was up, but they didn't know.
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Karen Koehler: And they especially didn't know the procedure.
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Genie Joseph: What was going to happen?
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Karen Koehler: And so I would tell them, this is what's going to happen.
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Karen Koehler: You will come and get you, and we will go over there, and I will be with you also.
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Karen Koehler: And then the vet will be there.
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Karen Koehler: And this is what will happen first.
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Karen Koehler: This is the shot that will happen first.
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Karen Koehler: And you will feel dizzy.
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Karen Koehler: You know, he will help you down.
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Karen Koehler: Hopefully, if everything went right.
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Karen Koehler: But I didn't go there.
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Karen Koehler: And I just think it was so important to explain that.
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Karen Koehler: Even, I mean, with any animal.
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Genie Joseph: Yes.
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Karen Koehler: You know, and I think it helps the human too.
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Karen Koehler: If you have to explain that to your animal, it also reassures you that you know the process.
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Karen Koehler: You're not going to be surprised when you get in there.
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Karen Koehler: It's not an easy thing to talk about, but they deserve that.
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Genie Joseph: Right.
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Genie Joseph: Definitely so.
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Karen Koehler: It's a little more calming, I think.
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Genie Joseph: So once they understand that it's going to happen and have some time to process, they're able to be peaceful through the process.
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Genie Joseph: Is that what you've seen?
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Genie Joseph: Does that help to make it?
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Genie Joseph: I think not all horse euthanasia go smoothly, right?
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Genie Joseph: It's not known for its smoothness.
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Genie Joseph: Yeah.
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Karen Koehler: And some pets use gunshot, and that doesn't always go smoothly either.
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Karen Koehler: But I would say the majority of the ones I've attended have.
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Karen Koehler: There was another beautiful one.
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Karen Koehler: These two horses were in together, and they were very bonded, a male and female, very bonded.
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Karen Koehler: And I was told, we're going to have trouble getting her out because she hates coming to the gate, you know, all these things.
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Karen Koehler: So again, has anyone told her, you know, and had a conversation with both of them?
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Karen Koehler: And he left.
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Karen Koehler: He's like, I don't want to hear this.
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Karen Koehler: I can't hear this.
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Karen Koehler: You know, so here I was having the conversation with the mayor that was going to be euthanized and again, honoring her life, blessing her.
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Karen Koehler: And when the time came, when they went to get her, she came right up to the gate.
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Genie Joseph: Yeah.
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Karen Koehler: It's just, yeah.
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Genie Joseph: Yeah.
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Genie Joseph: Yeah, I mean, they have this beautiful life force, and yet when it's time, they can be peaceful through the process if someone helps them, if someone explains it to them and gives them a chance to understand it.
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Genie Joseph: Yeah, that's interesting.
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Genie Joseph: I mean, I don't think we humans could do quite as well.
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Genie Joseph: I think that they definitely are more willing to accept the phases, the cycles of life than we are.
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Genie Joseph: You know, for us, it's very scary.
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Genie Joseph: We don't know what's going on.
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Genie Joseph: Yeah, yeah.
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Karen Koehler: I was going to say, and also explaining to them why this is happening.
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Karen Koehler: Because of your injury.
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Karen Koehler: Because your pain can't be controlled any longer.
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Karen Koehler: You know, so actually making sense out of it.
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Karen Koehler: And the other thing is, I also encourage them to call in any of their ancestors, to support them, to greet them.
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Karen Koehler: You go with them across the river to the land of the ancestors.
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Genie Joseph: Beautiful.
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Genie Joseph: Beautiful.
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Genie Joseph: Yeah, so in that way, it can be a very sacred process, it sounds, as you're describing it.
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Genie Joseph: And how is it for you to witness this to, you know, multiple, multiple witnessing of death?
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Genie Joseph: How do you manage it emotionally?
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Karen Koehler: Some are easier than others.
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Genie Joseph: Why is that?
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Genie Joseph: What makes it easier and not easy?
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Karen Koehler: I think the, you know, if I know they're in pain, and I know that pain can't be controlled, then I know they're ready.
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Karen Koehler: If they've lived a long and full life.
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Karen Koehler: Some of them, you know, if it's a behavior problem, that's a hard one.
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Genie Joseph: That's a hard one.
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Karen Koehler: Because I, unfortunately, I'm a fixer.
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Karen Koehler: I want to make it better.
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Karen Koehler: Yes, if I work with this horse, can we make it better?
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Karen Koehler: Yes, sometimes I have to just learn to let go.
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Genie Joseph: Yeah.
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Genie Joseph: Fascinating.
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Genie Joseph: Well, we're going to take a short little break.
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Genie Joseph: But when we come back, I would love it if you would tell us a little bit about how you experience animal communication.
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Genie Joseph: We've talked to several animal communicators, and everyone is just a little bit different in how they approach it.
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Genie Joseph: So we'd love to hear your tell us that we'll be right back in just a moment.
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Genie Joseph: Don't go anywhere.
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Announcer: Hey friends, if you like what you're hearing and want to learn more, check out Dr.
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Announcer: Joseph's book, The Human-Animal Connection, Deepening Relationships with Animals and Ourselves.
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Announcer: Or visit the website, thehumananimalconnection.org to book an online consultation.
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Announcer: Thank you for loving animals.
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Announcer: Now back to the show.
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Announcer: Let's Talk Pets on petliferadio.com.
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Genie Joseph: Welcome back to The Human-Animal Connection.
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Genie Joseph: I'm speaking with Karen Koehler, and we're learning about how horses respond to time of death.
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Genie Joseph: So tell us a little bit about how you communicate.
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Genie Joseph: I know you've been mentioning that you communicate with the animals, that you can tell them what's happening, that you can listen to their feelings, watch their responses.
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Genie Joseph: What's your process like?
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Genie Joseph: Are you communicating out loud, silently?
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Genie Joseph: How does that work?
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Karen Koehler: Ah, you know, it depends on the day.
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Karen Koehler: It depends on how I feel the animal needs that or how I need it.
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Karen Koehler: Mm-hmm.
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Karen Koehler: And sometimes I get a feeling.
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Karen Koehler: It's a knowing almost.
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Genie Joseph: Mm-hmm.
00:15:44.120 --> 00:15:45.700
Karen Koehler: Sometimes it's an actual word.
00:15:46.260 --> 00:15:46.980
Genie Joseph: Mm-hmm.
00:15:47.680 --> 00:15:54.120
Karen Koehler: I don't usually get actual words around death, but I have, you know.
00:15:54.240 --> 00:15:59.260
Karen Koehler: I walked up to this horse that I knew was colloquing.
00:15:59.280 --> 00:16:00.060
Genie Joseph: Mm-hmm.
00:16:00.420 --> 00:16:02.920
Karen Koehler: And I said, you know, I said, hey, but how's it going?
00:16:02.980 --> 00:16:03.400
Karen Koehler: You know?
00:16:03.980 --> 00:16:05.200
Karen Koehler: And all I heard was dying.
00:16:05.220 --> 00:16:06.680
Karen Koehler: Mm-hmm.
00:16:07.200 --> 00:16:07.580
Karen Koehler: You know?
00:16:07.600 --> 00:16:09.240
Karen Koehler: So that was, wow.
00:16:09.800 --> 00:16:10.220
Genie Joseph: Yes.
00:16:10.400 --> 00:16:14.160
Karen Koehler: I knew that wasn't from me because I wouldn't have said that, you know?
00:16:14.220 --> 00:16:14.640
Genie Joseph: Right.
00:16:16.220 --> 00:16:17.420
Karen Koehler: So that was interesting.
00:16:20.760 --> 00:16:30.920
Karen Koehler: Another time, and this wasn't a horse, this was a dog, but I was asking him some questions that his human had wanted to know.
00:16:30.940 --> 00:16:35.400
Karen Koehler: And, you know, what are you missing?
00:16:35.480 --> 00:16:37.400
Karen Koehler: Who are you missing?
00:16:38.140 --> 00:16:39.300
Karen Koehler: And I heard the word doc.
00:16:39.980 --> 00:16:44.360
Karen Koehler: Dios, you know, and I thought I said to her, oh, it sounds like he's missing his vet or something like that.
00:16:45.420 --> 00:16:46.320
Karen Koehler: And she goes back.
00:16:46.340 --> 00:16:49.280
Karen Koehler: She goes, no, that meant his duck.
00:16:50.180 --> 00:16:50.940
Genie Joseph: Oh, doc.
00:16:51.540 --> 00:16:55.160
Karen Koehler: Because they were in Australia and he had an accent and I didn't get it.
00:16:58.180 --> 00:17:00.660
Karen Koehler: But yeah, so I mean, it happens all different ways.
00:17:00.680 --> 00:17:01.440
Genie Joseph: Yeah.
00:17:02.280 --> 00:17:06.760
Karen Koehler: Sometimes it's in a meditation, in a shamanic journey.
00:17:08.100 --> 00:17:10.420
Karen Koehler: It's pictures sometimes.
00:17:10.820 --> 00:17:11.200
Genie Joseph: Yeah.
00:17:11.640 --> 00:17:13.320
Karen Koehler: So all different things.
00:17:13.800 --> 00:17:23.300
Genie Joseph: Wow, wow, and do you do any kind of morning rituals or is there any way that you just, yeah, what do you do?
00:17:23.320 --> 00:17:29.960
Karen Koehler: Well, the morning rituals that I've been part of have been with the horses themselves.
00:17:30.880 --> 00:17:42.280
Karen Koehler: So at one ritual, they met inside a shelter and one of the horses had died.
00:17:42.300 --> 00:17:51.280
Karen Koehler: And so there were three of them up there in the shelter and they allowed me to stand with them and just watch the sunset and you could feel the grief.
00:17:52.480 --> 00:17:56.280
Karen Koehler: And they met that day, they met that way for three days in a row.
00:17:57.400 --> 00:17:59.060
Karen Koehler: In the exact same place.
00:18:00.820 --> 00:18:02.880
Karen Koehler: And the fourth day, they were done.
00:18:03.820 --> 00:18:04.380
Genie Joseph: Interesting.
00:18:04.660 --> 00:18:05.000
Karen Koehler: Yeah.
00:18:06.160 --> 00:18:10.140
Karen Koehler: Because I went to look for them the fourth day and they're like, no, we're finished, we did it.
00:18:10.260 --> 00:18:10.780
Genie Joseph: We did it.
00:18:12.020 --> 00:18:12.400
Genie Joseph: Yeah.
00:18:13.080 --> 00:18:18.660
Karen Koehler: Another time, there were horses surrounding the body of a mare who had died in the pasture.
00:18:19.600 --> 00:18:21.580
Karen Koehler: And so they were just standing around her.
00:18:23.600 --> 00:18:24.860
Karen Koehler: And they allowed me to come in.
00:18:24.860 --> 00:18:26.240
Karen Koehler: I asked permission.
00:18:26.260 --> 00:18:37.900
Karen Koehler: And here I am going in, kneeling down next to this horse, and all of a sudden my brain goes, you know, you've got like 7,000 pounds standing around you.
00:18:38.020 --> 00:18:41.020
Karen Koehler: If they say, you're gone, you know.
00:18:41.940 --> 00:18:42.680
Karen Koehler: But they didn't.
00:18:42.840 --> 00:18:44.660
Karen Koehler: And I knew they wouldn't.
00:18:45.540 --> 00:18:46.920
Karen Koehler: They allowed me to bend down.
00:18:46.940 --> 00:18:48.000
Karen Koehler: They allowed me to bless her.
00:18:48.020 --> 00:18:49.360
Karen Koehler: They allowed me to kiss her goodbye.
00:18:49.380 --> 00:18:50.220
Genie Joseph: Oh.
00:18:50.900 --> 00:18:52.240
Karen Koehler: And then leave.
00:18:54.720 --> 00:18:59.440
Karen Koehler: Another time, a mare had lost her best friend in the herd.
00:19:00.600 --> 00:19:07.300
Karen Koehler: And I saw all of the other horses come around her, surround her in her grief.
00:19:08.900 --> 00:19:10.920
Karen Koehler: And it's just amazing.
00:19:11.040 --> 00:19:12.820
Karen Koehler: It's just so beautiful.
00:19:13.780 --> 00:19:15.900
Genie Joseph: It's like horses are better people than we are.
00:19:17.200 --> 00:19:17.740
Karen Koehler: They're nicer.
00:19:20.140 --> 00:19:21.140
Genie Joseph: Oh, my goodness.
00:19:21.900 --> 00:19:31.400
Genie Joseph: Well, on the people side, how do you help people maybe prepare for death or deal with death after the fact?
00:19:32.260 --> 00:19:33.040
Genie Joseph: How do you help them?
00:19:34.800 --> 00:19:37.400
Karen Koehler: I first try and find out what they're looking for.
00:19:38.260 --> 00:19:39.100
Karen Koehler: What do they need?
00:19:39.280 --> 00:19:48.800
Karen Koehler: And I tell them, if you need to get a message from your animal afterwards, if that will bring you comfort, ask your animal ahead of time.
00:19:50.620 --> 00:19:51.680
Karen Koehler: And be specific.
00:19:53.580 --> 00:20:06.040
Karen Koehler: If you need to see a leaf or a feather or a butterfly or something, be specific as to where or what kind, because then you won't be questioning yourself.
00:20:06.060 --> 00:20:07.140
Karen Koehler: You'll see it and you'll know.
00:20:07.600 --> 00:20:08.060
Genie Joseph: Yeah.
00:20:09.080 --> 00:20:09.860
Genie Joseph: That's beautiful.
00:20:09.880 --> 00:20:15.680
Genie Joseph: That's a beautiful thing to give someone is that to ask that request and to make it so specific.
00:20:15.700 --> 00:20:19.580
Genie Joseph: So you're not always wondering, is that was that my horse or was that just a leaf blowing?
00:20:20.660 --> 00:20:21.740
Karen Koehler: Yeah.
00:20:22.780 --> 00:20:23.860
Genie Joseph: That's really awesome.
00:20:24.060 --> 00:20:25.540
Genie Joseph: It's a lovely thing to add in.
00:20:26.160 --> 00:21:03.280
Karen Koehler: Another thing is if you can have someone with you, someone who can take care of the day-to-day things, so you can do the paperwork, if you're going to your vet's office, if the vet is coming to you, yeah, just have someone who can take care of things for you, so that you can focus on losing your animal, on their sacredness of their death, and just grieving, so that you don't have to worry about paying writing a check or giving your credit card or something.
00:21:03.300 --> 00:21:04.820
Genie Joseph: Yes, exactly.
00:21:04.840 --> 00:21:07.260
Karen Koehler: And if you can take care of those things ahead of time, that's even better.
00:21:09.920 --> 00:21:19.780
Genie Joseph: Have you noticed, I know not the gunshot scenario, but the lethal injection scenario, can you feel the moment when the spirit leaves?
00:21:19.960 --> 00:21:20.960
Genie Joseph: Have you felt that?
00:21:21.620 --> 00:21:22.200
Karen Koehler: Sometimes.
00:21:22.460 --> 00:21:23.060
Genie Joseph: Sometimes.
00:21:23.160 --> 00:21:23.640
Genie Joseph: Okay.
00:21:23.640 --> 00:21:24.740
Genie Joseph: Tell us about that.
00:21:26.420 --> 00:21:27.940
Karen Koehler: It's almost like a picture.
00:21:28.920 --> 00:21:31.580
Karen Koehler: It's a very gentle feeling.
00:21:31.720 --> 00:21:35.360
Karen Koehler: For me, it wasn't really strong.
00:21:36.700 --> 00:21:38.940
Karen Koehler: The last time, though, it was actually the wind came.
00:21:40.420 --> 00:21:41.380
Karen Koehler: That was amazing.
00:21:41.760 --> 00:21:45.920
Karen Koehler: Sometimes I just see a picture of horses coming towards and then horses leaving.
00:21:48.480 --> 00:21:49.760
Genie Joseph: That's so interesting.
00:21:50.540 --> 00:21:51.380
Genie Joseph: So interesting.
00:21:52.460 --> 00:21:54.180
Genie Joseph: That's amazing.
00:21:54.200 --> 00:21:58.480
Genie Joseph: So tell us a little bit about your reiki work.
00:21:59.200 --> 00:22:01.760
Genie Joseph: How does that work and when do you use your reiki work?
00:22:02.560 --> 00:22:11.360
Karen Koehler: I use my reiki work, I think, not as much with death as with just a horse who asks for it.
00:22:11.760 --> 00:22:12.160
Genie Joseph: Okay.
00:22:12.580 --> 00:22:18.360
Karen Koehler: No, I have to be careful because I'm in it right now.
00:22:18.620 --> 00:22:20.900
Karen Koehler: My horse is in a boarding barn.
00:22:21.880 --> 00:22:24.160
Karen Koehler: So all of these horses have their own humans.
00:22:24.500 --> 00:22:24.860
Genie Joseph: Yes.
00:22:25.160 --> 00:22:29.740
Karen Koehler: So if an animal is asking for something, I kind of have to talk to their human about it.
00:22:31.020 --> 00:22:31.980
Genie Joseph: And how do you explain it?
00:22:32.000 --> 00:22:36.340
Genie Joseph: Let's say the person doesn't believe in horses communicating and asking, you're saying, my knee is hurting.
00:22:37.180 --> 00:22:39.540
Genie Joseph: Like, how does it go when you talk to the human?
00:22:39.660 --> 00:22:43.060
Genie Joseph: Do you usually say yes, please, or oh, I don't know.
00:22:44.700 --> 00:22:49.720
Karen Koehler: Well, that's funny because in our chaplaincy class, we had to do a project.
00:22:50.180 --> 00:22:55.580
Karen Koehler: And so I was going to go out and bless the herd because we had to come up with blessings.
00:22:56.680 --> 00:23:01.820
Karen Koehler: And I thought, how am I going to bring this up to the humans that have horses in this herd?
00:23:01.840 --> 00:23:03.240
Karen Koehler: They're going to think I'm totally nuts.
00:23:03.620 --> 00:23:03.980
Genie Joseph: Yeah.
00:23:04.640 --> 00:23:05.440
Karen Koehler: Yeah, they already do.
00:23:05.460 --> 00:23:06.160
Karen Koehler: So why worry?
00:23:07.740 --> 00:23:10.600
Karen Koehler: You know, and I went to explain it to each one.
00:23:11.440 --> 00:23:13.400
Karen Koehler: Each one said, absolutely.
00:23:19.080 --> 00:23:22.180
Karen Koehler: I've never had a human that said, no, don't do anything to my horse.
00:23:23.220 --> 00:23:26.100
Karen Koehler: You know, it's like, yeah, okay, you want to try it?
00:23:26.200 --> 00:23:26.840
Karen Koehler: Go for it.
00:23:27.120 --> 00:23:28.480
Genie Joseph: Uh-huh.
00:23:28.580 --> 00:23:30.200
Karen Koehler: It's because it's so gentle.
00:23:30.220 --> 00:23:31.120
Karen Koehler: It's non-invasive.
00:23:31.360 --> 00:23:31.780
Genie Joseph: Right.
00:23:32.280 --> 00:23:40.480
Genie Joseph: Well, I love the idea that the horses ask for it, because it's not really appropriate to just go up and start healing horses or anybody.
00:23:41.940 --> 00:23:44.080
Genie Joseph: So, tell me a story about a horse asking for something.
00:23:44.100 --> 00:23:45.700
Genie Joseph: You did some reiki and what was the outcome?
00:23:46.340 --> 00:23:47.340
Karen Koehler: Oh, okay.
00:23:48.980 --> 00:23:49.340
Karen Koehler: Yeah.
00:23:49.420 --> 00:23:51.900
Karen Koehler: I think it's just comfort afterwards.
00:23:51.900 --> 00:23:53.100
Karen Koehler: You see the head nodding.
00:23:54.320 --> 00:23:55.860
Karen Koehler: You know, just that sense of peace.
00:23:58.480 --> 00:24:00.560
Genie Joseph: So you can feel a shift in the energy after you.
00:24:00.580 --> 00:24:01.580
Karen Koehler: Yeah, absolutely.
00:24:01.600 --> 00:24:02.380
Genie Joseph: Uh-huh.
00:24:02.960 --> 00:24:03.340
Genie Joseph: Yeah.
00:24:04.160 --> 00:24:12.500
Genie Joseph: And are they very clear, like, say, like such and such hurts or touch me here, or do they not always know or how aware are they or what's going on?
00:24:12.840 --> 00:24:13.300
Karen Koehler: Oh yeah.
00:24:13.320 --> 00:24:14.180
Karen Koehler: You put your hands up.
00:24:14.540 --> 00:24:14.860
Genie Joseph: Uh-huh.
00:24:15.620 --> 00:24:17.460
Karen Koehler: And they will move their body.
00:24:18.640 --> 00:24:19.680
Karen Koehler: To where they want it.
00:24:20.160 --> 00:24:20.640
Genie Joseph: Ooh.
00:24:20.920 --> 00:24:21.840
Karen Koehler: Yeah.
00:24:21.860 --> 00:24:25.780
Karen Koehler: That's just, it's like, and especially if you think you're doing it right.
00:24:26.040 --> 00:24:26.420
Genie Joseph: Yeah.
00:24:26.920 --> 00:24:27.640
Karen Koehler: And you're not.
00:24:27.840 --> 00:24:28.600
Genie Joseph: Yes.
00:24:28.600 --> 00:24:29.720
Karen Koehler: If you've misread it.
00:24:29.960 --> 00:24:30.820
Genie Joseph: Yes.
00:24:30.840 --> 00:24:31.660
Karen Koehler: They will shift.
00:24:31.680 --> 00:24:33.100
Karen Koehler: They go, ah, up here.
00:24:35.700 --> 00:24:36.640
Genie Joseph: That's so beautiful.
00:24:37.080 --> 00:24:38.580
Karen Koehler: And then when they're done, they're done.
00:24:38.840 --> 00:24:39.320
Genie Joseph: They're done.
00:24:39.340 --> 00:24:40.100
Genie Joseph: They just walk away.
00:24:40.100 --> 00:24:40.420
Genie Joseph: I know.
00:24:40.440 --> 00:24:40.800
Genie Joseph: I love it.
00:24:41.080 --> 00:24:51.840
Genie Joseph: It's like a dance, you know, and they're leading, we're following, you know, and it's just really feeling into that and letting them, you know, not missing a signal.
00:24:51.860 --> 00:24:55.600
Genie Joseph: Like when they move to their left or to their right or something that you understand.
00:24:55.620 --> 00:24:57.040
Genie Joseph: Okay, over here.
00:24:57.160 --> 00:24:57.500
Genie Joseph: Yes.
00:24:57.700 --> 00:24:58.080
Genie Joseph: You know?
00:24:58.100 --> 00:24:58.280
Genie Joseph: Yeah.
00:24:58.380 --> 00:24:59.620
Karen Koehler: They're not just shifting weight.
00:24:59.680 --> 00:25:00.020
Karen Koehler: Yeah.
00:25:00.040 --> 00:25:00.600
Genie Joseph: Right, right.
00:25:00.620 --> 00:25:01.260
Karen Koehler: To tell you something.
00:25:01.500 --> 00:25:01.880
Genie Joseph: Yeah.
00:25:02.120 --> 00:25:02.440
Genie Joseph: Yeah.
00:25:02.800 --> 00:25:04.840
Genie Joseph: I remember once working with a horse.
00:25:04.980 --> 00:25:06.220
Genie Joseph: I know I wasn't planning to work with him.
00:25:06.240 --> 00:25:16.240
Genie Joseph: I was teaching a class with a horse, and the horse just put out his leg in front like a ballerina, like put out his front leg, like stretched out.
00:25:16.240 --> 00:25:17.080
Genie Joseph: And I said, okay.
00:25:17.120 --> 00:25:21.760
Genie Joseph: And I just did my healing her, and everybody watched, and then he was done, and he just walked away.
00:25:21.780 --> 00:25:27.920
Genie Joseph: It was really a sweet feeling too, because I wasn't planning to do that.
00:25:27.940 --> 00:25:31.980
Genie Joseph: It was, he let me know what he needed, and he knew that I could do it.
00:25:32.000 --> 00:25:43.840
Genie Joseph: I mean, it wasn't, I had met this horse before, so it wasn't a complete stranger, but yeah, it's lovely when we can respond to them and to pay attention to their communication.
00:25:43.860 --> 00:25:45.160
Genie Joseph: That's really lovely.
00:25:45.500 --> 00:25:54.680
Genie Joseph: So what would you like people to know, maybe that have animals and are perhaps getting ready for this cycle of passing?
00:25:56.800 --> 00:25:58.000
Karen Koehler: Be kind with yourself.
00:25:58.620 --> 00:26:01.060
Karen Koehler: You're not always gonna feel like you're making the right decision.
00:26:01.240 --> 00:26:02.580
Karen Koehler: You're going to have questions.
00:26:04.580 --> 00:26:17.400
Karen Koehler: Get support, ask for support, whether it's your friends, your family, or someone who does animal communication.
00:26:17.980 --> 00:26:19.600
Karen Koehler: The right person will show up for you.
00:26:19.880 --> 00:26:22.280
Genie Joseph: You can trust that.
00:26:22.980 --> 00:26:25.720
Genie Joseph: Yeah, I think a lot of people struggle with, is it the right time?
00:26:25.740 --> 00:26:26.540
Genie Joseph: Is it too soon?
00:26:26.560 --> 00:26:27.260
Genie Joseph: Is it too late?
00:26:27.280 --> 00:26:27.840
Genie Joseph: Is it now?
00:26:27.860 --> 00:26:28.820
Genie Joseph: Is it later?
00:26:28.840 --> 00:26:38.840
Genie Joseph: You know, like that can be very torturous, and I think if everyone has a good animal communicator, they can get some help with that if they don't feel like they can communicate them.
00:26:38.860 --> 00:26:53.180
Genie Joseph: If they don't have the clarity themselves, if they don't feel that, it's so important, because otherwise you can be left with a lot of guilt or anger or upsetness that you didn't make the right decision or you didn't make it at the right time.
00:26:54.500 --> 00:26:54.880
Genie Joseph: Yeah.
00:26:55.580 --> 00:26:58.520
Genie Joseph: Have you ever had a horse say, no, I don't want to be euthanized?
00:26:59.400 --> 00:27:01.660
Karen Koehler: I've seen what I thought was that.
00:27:03.660 --> 00:27:05.600
Karen Koehler: But I wasn't in control of the situation.
00:27:05.860 --> 00:27:06.220
Genie Joseph: Right.
00:27:07.500 --> 00:27:09.660
Karen Koehler: It was somewhere else.
00:27:09.780 --> 00:27:11.480
Karen Koehler: And so all I could do, yeah.
00:27:12.180 --> 00:27:18.180
Karen Koehler: And I could say that I don't think this animal's ready, but it was their time.
00:27:19.640 --> 00:27:20.760
Genie Joseph: So, yeah.
00:27:20.940 --> 00:27:21.680
Karen Koehler: Which was hard.
00:27:22.100 --> 00:27:23.580
Genie Joseph: Yes, it was very hard.
00:27:24.100 --> 00:27:24.420
Karen Koehler: Yeah.
00:27:24.660 --> 00:27:25.980
Genie Joseph: It's a tough business to be in.
00:27:27.560 --> 00:27:40.880
Genie Joseph: But I guess, well, maybe I shouldn't say that, because from a spiritual point of view, these animals are also leaving the human world and perhaps entering a better one.
00:27:40.980 --> 00:27:41.820
Genie Joseph: Is that possible?
00:27:42.420 --> 00:27:43.640
Genie Joseph: What do you think about that?
00:27:44.060 --> 00:27:44.740
Karen Koehler: Absolutely.
00:27:45.380 --> 00:27:46.020
Karen Koehler: Absolutely.
00:27:47.840 --> 00:27:49.520
Karen Koehler: And also, we don't know their paths.
00:27:50.960 --> 00:27:56.420
Karen Koehler: You know, it could be that it was their time, and it was part of a lesson for all of us.
00:27:56.780 --> 00:27:57.140
Genie Joseph: Yes.
00:27:57.600 --> 00:27:57.920
Genie Joseph: Right.
00:27:59.820 --> 00:28:00.980
Karen Koehler: So I can't make that call.
00:28:01.360 --> 00:28:01.720
Genie Joseph: Right.
00:28:02.540 --> 00:28:02.920
Genie Joseph: Right.
00:28:03.280 --> 00:28:21.200
Genie Joseph: So would you say that you have a certain neutrality about death now that you've done so much work in the sense that you don't see it as either good or bad, but that it's just a larger destiny at work or larger timing at work?
00:28:21.220 --> 00:28:22.040
Genie Joseph: What are your thoughts?
00:28:22.060 --> 00:28:23.340
Genie Joseph: I don't want to put words in your mouth.
00:28:23.360 --> 00:28:24.100
Genie Joseph: What do you think about that?
00:28:24.120 --> 00:28:24.540
Karen Koehler: No, no, no.
00:28:24.560 --> 00:28:25.260
Karen Koehler: That's great.
00:28:26.160 --> 00:28:32.000
Karen Koehler: When I was in my 20s, I had an out-of-body experience where I was shown my grandfather.
00:28:32.020 --> 00:28:34.480
Karen Koehler: I could feel him right beside me.
00:28:35.680 --> 00:28:41.960
Karen Koehler: And when I left my body, I was completely surrounded by stars, and I was shown the light.
00:28:42.820 --> 00:28:45.280
Karen Koehler: And I was told that I was being shown this for a reason.
00:28:46.020 --> 00:28:49.080
Karen Koehler: And all I could feel was total, unconditional love.
00:28:50.240 --> 00:28:52.840
Karen Koehler: It was amazing, the lightness of being.
00:28:55.260 --> 00:28:57.040
Karen Koehler: And I didn't understand it at the time.
00:28:57.060 --> 00:28:58.320
Karen Koehler: I was in my 20s.
00:29:00.260 --> 00:29:05.140
Karen Koehler: And so, but I just, I knew, I knew it was amazing.
00:29:05.160 --> 00:29:11.000
Karen Koehler: And I was, I saw beings walking towards the light, beings coming back from the light.
00:29:11.020 --> 00:29:14.700
Karen Koehler: And I was told that the ones coming back, it just wasn't their time yet.
00:29:16.340 --> 00:29:19.720
Karen Koehler: And ever since then, I haven't had a fear of death.
00:29:19.800 --> 00:29:22.000
Karen Koehler: I thought, it's amazing.
00:29:22.020 --> 00:29:24.260
Karen Koehler: It's beautiful, you know.
00:29:25.120 --> 00:29:27.900
Karen Koehler: But we can't go until it's our time.
00:29:28.240 --> 00:29:28.560
Genie Joseph: Right.
00:29:30.480 --> 00:29:41.660
Karen Koehler: But it's made it so that when I'm with an animal that's dying, I'm able to say to them, it will be so amazing.
00:29:41.680 --> 00:29:42.640
Karen Koehler: You will have no pain.
00:29:42.660 --> 00:29:44.080
Karen Koehler: You will feel such peace.
00:29:45.140 --> 00:29:46.580
Karen Koehler: You'll feel such freedom.
00:29:47.840 --> 00:29:48.260
Karen Koehler: You know?
00:29:49.200 --> 00:29:51.400
Karen Koehler: So I think that's why I'm in this.
00:29:51.420 --> 00:29:53.180
Karen Koehler: I was raised by a hospice nurse, too.
00:29:53.260 --> 00:29:54.880
Genie Joseph: Oh, yeah.
00:29:55.720 --> 00:29:56.240
Karen Koehler: Yeah.
00:29:56.920 --> 00:29:58.540
Genie Joseph: You were born into the death business.
00:29:59.040 --> 00:29:59.600
Karen Koehler: I know.
00:30:01.120 --> 00:30:01.940
Genie Joseph: That's beautiful.
00:30:02.160 --> 00:30:05.440
Genie Joseph: Well, it was clearly your destiny to do this work.
00:30:06.520 --> 00:30:09.980
Genie Joseph: Well, it's just been absolutely delightful to speak with you.
00:30:10.660 --> 00:30:13.780
Genie Joseph: How can people get in touch with you if they'd like to connect with you?
00:30:16.300 --> 00:30:21.460
Karen Koehler: Which would be kkequinespirit at gmail.com.
00:30:22.000 --> 00:30:22.500
Genie Joseph: Wonderful.
00:30:22.660 --> 00:30:23.080
Genie Joseph: Wonderful.
00:30:23.500 --> 00:30:23.900
Genie Joseph: All right.
00:30:24.500 --> 00:30:26.600
Genie Joseph: Last words before we say aloha.
00:30:27.540 --> 00:30:28.780
Genie Joseph: What would you like to leave people with?
00:30:29.620 --> 00:30:30.480
Karen Koehler: Last words.
00:30:31.900 --> 00:30:34.600
Karen Koehler: If you can, send them with love.
00:30:35.560 --> 00:30:36.260
Karen Koehler: It's their time.
00:30:38.180 --> 00:30:39.420
Karen Koehler: It's hard when we're hurting.
00:30:39.600 --> 00:30:41.220
Karen Koehler: It's hard when we're grieving.
00:30:41.900 --> 00:30:50.460
Karen Koehler: But if you can put that just a little bit to the side and focus on love, your heart to their heart, and just keep that circle going.
00:30:51.020 --> 00:30:53.800
Karen Koehler: It's such a beautiful way for them to depart.
00:30:54.220 --> 00:30:54.760
Genie Joseph: Wonderful.
00:30:55.280 --> 00:30:56.920
Genie Joseph: Living and leaving in love.
00:30:57.440 --> 00:30:58.040
Karen Koehler: Yeah.
00:30:59.860 --> 00:31:01.200
Genie Joseph: Well, thank you so much, Karen.
00:31:01.220 --> 00:31:03.440
Genie Joseph: It was wonderful to have you here for us.
00:31:03.460 --> 00:31:04.760
Karen Koehler: Thank you.
00:31:06.640 --> 00:31:07.040
Genie Joseph: All right.
00:31:07.060 --> 00:31:10.240
Genie Joseph: So we'll see you all next or hear you all next.
00:31:10.400 --> 00:31:11.660
Genie Joseph: We'll say aloha for now.
00:31:11.680 --> 00:31:15.320
Genie Joseph: Thank you for being part of the audience of The Human-Animal Connection.
00:31:22.980 --> 00:31:28.120
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00:31:28.460 --> 00:31:34.960
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00:31:35.320 --> 00:31:46.280
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00:31:46.760 --> 00:31:52.100
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00:31:52.500 --> 00:31:58.740
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00:32:01.440 --> 00:32:07.400
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