Bringing the Outdoors In: How to Create a Cat Wonderland in the Safety of Your Home
Ever wonder what your indoor cat dreams about while gazing out the window? The answer might just be the great outdoors! This week Michelle Fern welcomes back Dr. Amy Shirley and Pam Johnson-Bennett to talk about creating a cat wonderland in your home! If you've got a curious furball, why not spice things up and let them enjoy the best of both worlds – the safe and comfortable indoors and the thrill of the natural realm! Picture this: your kitty adventurer, capturing their “prey” in a treat puzzle, basking on strategically placed perches, and having a blast with indoor cat grass and catnip gardens. Discover easy ways to provide your cat with a connection to nature, while boosting their physical and mental wellbeing.
Listen to Episode #232 Now:
BIO:
Pam Johnson-Bennett is one of the most popular and sought-after cat behavior experts in the world. She has a private cat-consulting practice in Nashville, appears on Animal Planet UK and Canada, and lectures on cat behavior at veterinary and animal welfare conferences around the world. She's been featured on CNN, Fox News Channel, CBS, ABC, NBC, Fox & Friends, Animal Planet Radio, and many more shows. Print profiles include Wall Street Journal, The New York Times, Real Simple, Better Homes & Gardens, Woman's World, Newsweek, Prevention, USA Today, Family Circle, Complete Woman, Newsday, Chicago Tribune, USA Weekend, Washington Post, and Parade. She was VP of the International Association of Animal Behavior Consultants and founded the IAABC Cat Division. Pam served on the American Humane Association's Advisory Board on Animal Behavior and Training. She lives in Nashville, TN.
Dr. Amy Shirley, originally from Tracy City, Tennessee, first came to Murfreesboro as an MTSU student and met her husband Michael while both were studying Animal Science in college. Dr. Shirley went on to graduate with her veterinary degree from the University of Tennessee in Knoxville in 2005. After graduation, Dr. Shirley moved back to Murfreesboro to practice as a small animal veterinarian including 10 years as an associate doctor and 3 years practicing as a relief doctor in the greater Middle Tennessee area.
Dr. Shirley and her family have lived in the Buchanan area since 2007 and accepted the opportunity to purchase Black Fox Veterinary Hospital in the Murfreesboro/Buchanan community in 2018. Later that year, they renamed the practice Family Pet Health. Since that time, she has worked to provide trusted care and be the family doctor for the pets in the community.
Dr. Shirley set out with a mission to create a positive and collaborative work environment that cares about the wellbeing and mental health of her doctors and team as a top priority. She believes that if she can take care of her team, they will take care of the clients and patients. She also is focused on the emotional well-being as well as the physical well-being of her patients. She was an early adopter of the Fear Free approach to veterinary medicine which helps diagnose and treat fear, anxiety, and stress in our patients especially when receiving medical attention. Dr. Shirley and her team at Family Pet Health were proud to become the first Fear Free Certified veterinary hospital in Rutherford County in 2019. Dr. Shirley hopes to build on this foundation to improve the lives of her team and patients. Dr. Shirley loves all species of animals but has a special devotion to the feline patient and small mammals such as rabbits and guinea pigs.
Dr. Shirley developed a love for the human-animal bond growing up and was very active in 4-H. She has fond memories of showing sheep and horses. Now she and Michael have 3 children of their own and enjoy seeing them participate in 4-H and finding their own interests and activities. Their family enjoys taking day trips and vacations together such as hiking and camping in their pop-up camper with a goal of visiting all the state parks in Tennessee. She and her family love their local church family at New Vision Baptist Church at Buchanan. Her children say that she enjoys working as a vet and cleaning the house as this is where she spends much of her time!
Transcript:
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Announcer: This is PetLife Radio.
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Announcer: Let's talk pets.
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Michelle Fern: Hello feline friends! Welcome to Cattitude! I'm your show host, Michelle Fern.
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Michelle Fern: So, you know, you have cats, and they're, you know, cats are mostly in your house.
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Michelle Fern: You might have a catio, but how can you make it really fun for your cats?
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Michelle Fern: Well, stay tuned.
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Michelle Fern: I have two amazing guests today, and we're gonna talk about the wonderful things you could do to your home to make it more cat-friendly.
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Michelle Fern: We'll be right back after this message.
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Announcer: Let's talk pets on petliferadio.com.
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Michelle Fern: Welcome back, everyone.
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Michelle Fern: I'd like to welcome Pam Johnson-Bennett.
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Michelle Fern: She is a best-selling author and a cat behavior expert.
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Michelle Fern: And I would also like to welcome Dr.
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Michelle Fern: Amy Shirley, who is a veterinarian and is also a level three fear-free certified professional.
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Michelle Fern: So ladies, can you tell a little bit about yourself?
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: I am a certified cat behavior consultant, and I have been in this field for over 40 years.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: I love cats, I love helping cat parents develop the relationship that they always wanted with their cats.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: I have written eight books and I do private consultations and I lecture and I will just lecture you about your cat's behavior any chance I get.
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Michelle Fern: Thank you.
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Michelle Fern: And Dr.
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Michelle Fern: Shirley?
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Dr. Amy Shirley: Yes, thank you so much for having me.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: I'm Dr.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: Amy Shirley and I have a veterinary hospital where we see primarily small animals, dogs and cats.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: I also have a love for felines and so also for behavior.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: And so we have joined with fear free certification in order to have a fear free practice.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: And what that means is that we do kind of join the physical health of your pet, as well as their emotional health.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: And so we look at stress as it relates to coming into the vet office.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: We do things a little bit differently, just low stress handling.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: The environment is set up in such a way that we really try to minimize stress if they're in the hospital, if they're here for an appointment, everything is just designed and set up in such a way so that they're not stressed when they come to have medical things or annual checkups and that sort of thing.
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Michelle Fern: I love that.
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Michelle Fern: And before we talk about how to create a cat wonderland, let's talk about something that it depends on the cat.
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Michelle Fern: Some cats are easy, some cats are not.
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Michelle Fern: Getting your cat in the carrier, which is part of your cat wonderland in your home.
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Michelle Fern: So you could bring the cat to your veterinarian.
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Michelle Fern: Dennis will walk in.
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Michelle Fern: The other two, I had to cancel an appointment once I couldn't get her in the crate.
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Michelle Fern: So what are some things we could do before we get into creating a cat wonderland?
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Michelle Fern: Let's talk about how we can make the cat carrier more cat friendly.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: You wanna start with training and it's never too early.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: If you have a kitten, get that kitten comfortable with being in a carrier.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And I recommend a kennel type carrier, the plastic one where it comes apart and you just leave it open.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: You leave the door open or you can take the door off, put a towel in there, get the cat comfortable with using that as a little hideaway.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: Feed the cat around the carrier, toss treats around there and eventually inside the carrier.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And then a big mistake that people make is they get the cat in the carrier and then they take them in the car and the first place they go is the veterinarian.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And so the cat is terrified of being in the carrier, terrified of the motion of the car and then the visit ends up at the veterinary clinic.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: So the association of the carrier is, oh my gosh, I hate this.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: So you want to get the cat comfortable with being in the carrier, being in the car, the sound of the car being turned on in each subsequent session, you know, then driving around the block and not always ending up at the veterinary clinic.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And I also recommend, and Dr.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: Shirley can talk more about this on her end of it, on the receiving end, is go to the veterinary clinic for hello visits.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: You know, get the cat comfortable with, you know, being touched and being in that veterinary environment where nothing happens.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: The more you socialize the cat and acclimate the cat to things that are going to happen in life, the easier it will be for those annual vet visits, but also in an emergency.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: In an emergency, you do not want to be crawling under the bed to get your cat out and shove him in the carrier.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: We want to make this experience easy, stress-free, and we want to get the cats to the veterinary clinic to get the help they need.
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Michelle Fern: That is such great advice.
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Michelle Fern: And Dr.
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Michelle Fern: Shirley, what can you add to that from your end?
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Dr. Amy Shirley: Sure, absolutely.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: No, I agree with all that.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: And I was just going to add that, you know, cats are different and that they are more attached to place versus dogs get attached more to people.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: I mean, cats do too, but cats are very attached to place.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: And so their pet taxi can be like their safe base camp.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: So you can bring that with you when you travel or go to the vet.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: And so you're bringing a little piece of their home with them.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: So I do recommend having it out, not just we used to tell people, we'll get it out a week or two before you go to the vet.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: So they're used to seeing it.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: But I would recommend if possible, having it out all the time as part of their daily, you know, interactions with it.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: Like you said, when you feed them in there, let them take naps in it.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: So that way when they do go into a stressful environment, they have something very familiar that they can bring with them.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: One little tip some people forget is when you come home from the veterinary clinic, especially if your cat has had any kind of procedure, wash the carrier.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: Don't just put it back out in the house again.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: Wash it, put a fresh towel in there, especially if you have a multi cat environment where the other cats are coming around.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: You don't want them to smell the carrier and get scared by it.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: So that's something we forget on the coming home end.
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Michelle Fern: Great advice.
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Michelle Fern: Okay, let's talk now about your cat wonderland.
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Michelle Fern: And first, what about catnip?
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Michelle Fern: So I know that some cats, there's a small percentage of cats that don't have any of the catnip doesn't have any effect on it.
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Michelle Fern: But is it true that catnip is kind of like a cocktail for your cats?
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: It's a great way to just lower those inhibitions.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And I use it in consultations with cats who are frightened cats were trying to develop a bond, a cat who has just been cat who's depressed, a cat who's overweight, and doesn't really move much or a cat who's reluctant to play.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: It's a really powerful tool, catnip is fun, but it's also beneficial.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And so using it correctly, it's an important tool in your behavior toolbox, but cat parents either don't use it because they're afraid of it.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: They think, oh, I don't want my cat drugged, but it's not an addictive substance.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: Or they use it too much.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: They just get toys that have catnip in it.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And that's something I don't recommend.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: You want to know the catnip that you're using.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: So the toys that already have catnip in them, you don't know the quality of the catnip.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: You don't even know if it's catnip at all.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: So I like to get a toy and I marinate the toy in a container that I've put catnip in.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And I like good, fresh, organic catnip.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And in our house, I use pet greens because I know the company and know the quality of the catnip, but it's a powerful tool and it's fun.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: How great is that for cats that they get to have all this fun and there's no downside to it.
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Michelle Fern: And then what about how much he should use because I just sprinkle a little and then sometimes my partner, he'll say, you know, oh, that makes them crazy.
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Michelle Fern: I don't want them so crazy, but I think they're just having fun.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: They are having fun.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: It just removes all those inhibitions and they just get to enjoy and be silly.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And catnip comes either dried, which you can rub on a toy.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: I like the fresh catnip and you can either pluck a leaf and let the cat sniff it and eat it.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: It's okay if they eat it, even though the effect is going by them smelling it.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: It's safe for them to eat.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: Or as I said before, you can marinate a toy with it.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: A couple things.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: Do not give catnip.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: In my opinion, you should not give catnip more than two or three times a week because they can lose their ability to react to it if you leave it out all the time.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: So I make it a special thing.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: The other thing is each cat is individual in how they react to it.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: So give catnip if you're doing it for the first time.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: Isolate that cat and give that cat catnip to see how they are.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: Some male cats can get a little too enthusiastic and you don't want anything.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: You don't want them to get a little too rough with another cat.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: So see how each cat reacts to it.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: But in general, it's just such a fun time.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: It's like 15, 20 minutes where they just get to have a blast.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And imagine how great that is if a cat has been stressed about something or depressed or just doesn't feel trusting enough to be able to play.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: So it's nature's it's such a gift from nature.
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Michelle Fern: And Dr.
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Michelle Fern: Shirley, what are your thoughts?
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Dr. Amy Shirley: No, I love that so much.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: And I'll just speak about how we incorporate some of that enrichment in the veterinary office too, because we do sometimes offer catnip, you know, during their visit.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: And it's just they don't may not act the same as they would at home with it, but it can change their emotional response in any small way to bring their stress level down.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: Sometimes we'll offer them things to smell.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: And we offer a variety of treats, sometimes like tuna or a churu is a popular liquid kind of cat treat that they often will even just smelling it, I think sometimes will lower their emotional stress level.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: And that's our goal, is just to try to bring it down as much as we can while they're in our hospital.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: And kittens and stuff like that, I know you mentioned, you know, doing things to have so they have a positive response.
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Dr. Amy Shirley: So we start when their kittens will have toys or cat wands in the room that they can play with so that they're so going to the vet doesn't have to be equal to stressful or unpleasant.
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Michelle Fern: That's great.
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Michelle Fern: All right, we're going to be right back right after this break.
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Announcer: Let's Talk Pest on Pet Life Radio.
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Michelle Fern: Welcome back, everyone.
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Michelle Fern: We're talking to Pam Johnson-Bennett and Dr.
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Michelle Fern: Amy Shirley about catnip and all kinds of wonderful things you could do for your cat at home.
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Michelle Fern: So how can we tap into our cat's natural hunting instinct at home and make things fun for our cat?
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: Well, outdoors, cats would have all this stimulation to hunt.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: You never know what they're gonna come across and they're gonna hunt, but we want to keep our cats safe.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: Outdoors, there's so many unpredictable and dangerous things out there.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: But when we bring our cats indoors, we don't just want to, life shouldn't stop.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: They shouldn't just become couch potatoes.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: So we want to incorporate the things that they would naturally do to hunt and to play, to climb, to do all those cat things that are the essence of cat life.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And so since you don't have to bring in a mouse for them to hunt, you can use an interactive toy, which is basically just a fishing pole toy type that has a wand, a string and a toy on the end.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And the great part about that is if you do that at least a couple times a day for a minimum of 15 minutes each, then on a regular basis, you're giving your cat that stimulation so that not only physically is it beneficial because they're getting to move, it's mentally beneficial because they're engaging what's natural for them.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And it's a great bonding experience for you.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: So interactive playtime a couple times a day.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And the key is move the toy like prey.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: We don't want to have the toy waving around like crazy and the cat never gets it because that's not how they hunt.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: They use their brain and their stealth as much as they're jumping and leaping.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: So if you move the toy like prey, moving across or away from the cat's visual field, alternate in the air with on the ground movements, the cat gets that stimulation and gets to really engage that brilliant brain and then let them have a lot of little captures and then one grand capture at the end of the game.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: And that's a great way to start with enrichment.
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Pam Johnson-Bennett: That just letting your cat have fun.
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Michelle Fern: Dr.
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Michelle Fern: Shirley, what are some things that you would suggest to a pet parent to add some cat fun to their home?
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Dr. Amy Shirley: Yeah, so I love that and I love that it also is good for their physical health too.
00:14:52.311 --> 00:15:06.611
Dr. Amy Shirley: We see a lot of obesity in our feline patients and so really encourage people to portion feed and having that 15 minutes of playtime a couple of times a day can keep their muscle tone up and try to prevent excessive weight gain as well.
00:15:06.951 --> 00:15:11.151
Pam Johnson-Bennett: You want to provide the cat with what they would naturally have.
00:15:11.571 --> 00:15:14.151
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So, example, we talked about playtime.
00:15:14.171 --> 00:15:16.791
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Yes, they would naturally hunt, so you do that through playtime.
00:15:17.131 --> 00:15:22.071
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Scratching posts, cats would scratch outside, whether it's on a tree or a fence post.
00:15:22.431 --> 00:15:26.131
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So you want to have a good, rough scratching post.
00:15:26.311 --> 00:15:28.191
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Cats would climb outside.
00:15:28.411 --> 00:15:33.611
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So you want to have climbing structures, whether it's a cat tree or sturdy cat shelves.
00:15:34.051 --> 00:15:40.131
Pam Johnson-Bennett: You want to let the cat be able to engage in natural behaviors in the indoor environment.
00:15:40.151 --> 00:15:45.151
Pam Johnson-Bennett: And that's the key to enrichment, so that the cat isn't just, well, I have nothing to do.
00:15:45.171 --> 00:15:48.991
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So all I'm going to do is eat or sleep or hide under the bed.
00:15:49.211 --> 00:15:56.411
Pam Johnson-Bennett: You want them to have those adventures so that they are engaging in normal, natural and beneficial behaviors.
00:15:57.571 --> 00:16:00.751
Michelle Fern: And what about taking some of their toys away?
00:16:00.771 --> 00:16:05.651
Michelle Fern: Because I've heard sometimes when they get overloaded when there's too much in front of them.
00:16:05.731 --> 00:16:07.091
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Well, you can rotate toys.
00:16:07.111 --> 00:16:09.391
Pam Johnson-Bennett: You don't have to have 10,000 toys out.
00:16:09.751 --> 00:16:16.671
Pam Johnson-Bennett: You can rotate them and it'll be like new and you can marinate little solo toys in catnip.
00:16:16.971 --> 00:16:18.851
Pam Johnson-Bennett: And then that becomes a brand new toy.
00:16:19.271 --> 00:16:20.531
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Interactive toys.
00:16:21.051 --> 00:16:26.251
Pam Johnson-Bennett: I recommend that you have something that you can be a bird with.
00:16:26.271 --> 00:16:35.431
Pam Johnson-Bennett: You have something that could be like a snake, something that could be like a bug or a mouse, because cats are opportunistic and they don't know what prey is going to be available.
00:16:35.451 --> 00:16:39.791
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So this way they can, you give them the opportunity to use a different hunting technique.
00:16:40.231 --> 00:16:43.971
Pam Johnson-Bennett: It's not so much how many toys, it's how you use them.
00:16:44.251 --> 00:16:49.791
Pam Johnson-Bennett: And also with solo toys, I don't just put them in a toy basket or a box.
00:16:50.091 --> 00:16:57.271
Pam Johnson-Bennett: I strategically place them for my cat to find during the day so that she has these little opportunities to hunt.
00:16:57.631 --> 00:17:21.531
Pam Johnson-Bennett: A little fuzzy mouse I might put on the edge of the perch of her cat tree with the tail hanging down, or I might have a mylar ball just peeking out from the leg of a piece of furniture, or I'll take a paper bag that doesn't have any handles on it, put it on its side and I'll stick a toy in there so that when she walks into the room, she sees the bag, looks in there, sees something and dives in there and plays for a while.
00:17:21.911 --> 00:17:28.931
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So you can set it up little things so that they have these little moments of playtime throughout the day when you're not around.
00:17:28.951 --> 00:17:30.871
Michelle Fern: Those are some great ideas.
00:17:31.431 --> 00:17:31.591
Michelle Fern: Dr.
00:17:31.611 --> 00:17:34.931
Michelle Fern: Shirley, is there anything you do a special loop for your cat?
00:17:35.231 --> 00:17:37.431
Dr. Amy Shirley: Yeah, I think, as she's saying, just being creative.
00:17:37.451 --> 00:17:52.031
Dr. Amy Shirley: I know we have a cat tower that to me looked like it was in a great location and it was near a big hall window and they just didn't get on it very much, even though they come into that, it's our living room area and we had just moved it randomly to the other side of the living room.
00:17:52.111 --> 00:17:55.931
Dr. Amy Shirley: It's not even 10 feet from where it was and now they get on it all the time.
00:17:55.951 --> 00:17:57.531
Dr. Amy Shirley: They're using the scratching post on it.
00:17:57.551 --> 00:17:58.611
Dr. Amy Shirley: They sit up on the top.
00:17:58.631 --> 00:18:01.391
Dr. Amy Shirley: So for whatever, you know, from their perspective.
00:18:01.751 --> 00:18:05.951
Dr. Amy Shirley: So sometimes playing around with different things, but I do agree, they love vertical spaces.
00:18:05.971 --> 00:18:07.291
Dr. Amy Shirley: They love being able to get high.
00:18:07.891 --> 00:18:17.871
Dr. Amy Shirley: And especially if you have a multi-cat household, you wanna have multiple resources in different locations and places where they can increase their territory by getting up higher.
00:18:17.891 --> 00:18:23.891
Dr. Amy Shirley: You know, even if you're in a small space, that can add to their territory by adding those vertical spaces.
00:18:24.471 --> 00:18:25.891
Michelle Fern: What about cat TV?
00:18:26.231 --> 00:18:33.791
Michelle Fern: So if you're setting up some kind of outside a window area, a bird feeder or a squirrel feeder, something like that.
00:18:34.111 --> 00:18:35.711
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Well, some cats will love that.
00:18:35.991 --> 00:18:40.171
Pam Johnson-Bennett: I have bird feeders outside for my cat, but my yard is very secure.
00:18:40.311 --> 00:18:48.131
Pam Johnson-Bennett: If you set up a bird feeder and it's going to entice the neighborhood cats around and that's gonna stress your cat out, then that's not a good idea.
00:18:48.151 --> 00:18:51.611
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So you have to base that on your individual circumstances.
00:18:52.011 --> 00:18:54.251
Pam Johnson-Bennett: There's even actually cat TV.
00:18:54.271 --> 00:19:00.871
Pam Johnson-Bennett: You can go on YouTube and find videos of mice and chipmunks and bugs and things that could entertain your cat.
00:19:01.051 --> 00:19:11.051
Pam Johnson-Bennett: But anything that you're gonna do that's visually stimulating, which is great, you also want to make sure you incorporate actual playtime so that the cat gets to actually hunt.
00:19:11.451 --> 00:19:15.771
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Just don't underestimate the value of that actual playtime with your cat.
00:19:15.991 --> 00:19:20.151
Michelle Fern: Okay, that makes me want to go out and buy some more of those cat toys.
00:19:20.411 --> 00:19:25.411
Michelle Fern: I love the ones that I think the most interactive are the ones with the rod, you know?
00:19:25.811 --> 00:19:31.951
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Right, and it lets you control the movement, but also it puts a distance between you and the cat.
00:19:31.971 --> 00:19:45.231
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So if you have a cat who is very frightened, you know, I do this a lot with cats that I'm doing rehab with, cats that came out of shelters or traumatic environments, and they don't want to come out from their little hiding space.
00:19:45.431 --> 00:19:49.811
Pam Johnson-Bennett: I use the toy, I don't dangle it in their face, but I just move it enticingly.
00:19:50.151 --> 00:19:54.231
Pam Johnson-Bennett: But I'm at a distance where they feel maybe it's okay to venture out a little bit.
00:19:54.471 --> 00:20:05.731
Pam Johnson-Bennett: And if you have a cat who hasn't played much, even if they're under the bed and they stick a paw out, or you see their pupils react, or their ears perk up, or their whiskers go forward, it's a start.
00:20:05.991 --> 00:20:10.491
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So even those little things can mean you're starting to break down that wall.
00:20:11.031 --> 00:20:16.291
Dr. Amy Shirley: And Pam, you may want to talk about this too, because get your opinion on catios, like outdoor spaces.
00:20:16.911 --> 00:20:19.671
Dr. Amy Shirley: I know I have two cats that are bonded brothers.
00:20:20.211 --> 00:20:26.711
Dr. Amy Shirley: One is very much interested in being outdoors, like if he gets an opportunity to try to get out the door when the dog goes out.
00:20:27.071 --> 00:20:37.231
Dr. Amy Shirley: And so we've incorporated some leash time, like sometimes we'll take him out on the leash, and he just loves to roll around in the dirt or on our patio concrete, and just get outdoors and sniff the air.
00:20:37.631 --> 00:20:41.251
Dr. Amy Shirley: Our other cat is not quite so confident and prefers to just stay indoors.
00:20:41.691 --> 00:20:46.591
Dr. Amy Shirley: But we are thinking about building a catio, so I'm just interested to see your perspective on that too.
00:20:46.951 --> 00:20:53.671
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Yeah, I think catios are great as long as they're very, very sturdy, and the cat always has a way to come back inside.
00:20:53.811 --> 00:21:02.731
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Leash training is great too, but it's a long process indoors before you ever get your cat outdoors, and not every cat is a candidate for leash training.
00:21:03.071 --> 00:21:04.591
Pam Johnson-Bennett: But catios are great.
00:21:04.871 --> 00:21:15.271
Pam Johnson-Bennett: If you want to allow your cat outside, a catio is the safest way to do it, but you just want to make sure it's really, really sturdy and the cat has the option to come back inside.
00:21:15.571 --> 00:21:23.191
Pam Johnson-Bennett: And one thing is always in the summer, especially make sure there are options for shade if the cat wants to be out there, because cats can get sunburned too.
00:21:23.671 --> 00:21:24.471
Michelle Fern: Great advice.
00:21:24.571 --> 00:21:26.551
Michelle Fern: And, you know, I live in the south.
00:21:26.831 --> 00:21:29.891
Michelle Fern: It's the furthest place south, but we're not a southern place.
00:21:29.911 --> 00:21:37.191
Michelle Fern: So I'm in Fort Lauderdale, and I call it the catio because it's their place, but it's really a patio for humans and cats.
00:21:37.491 --> 00:21:40.391
Michelle Fern: And they have a lot going on out there.
00:21:40.711 --> 00:21:42.311
Michelle Fern: You know, it's covered, there's a fan.
00:21:42.671 --> 00:21:46.111
Michelle Fern: We watch and make sure that they're not out there too long.
00:21:46.131 --> 00:21:49.371
Michelle Fern: We don't even let them go out when it's too hot.
00:21:49.591 --> 00:21:49.871
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Right.
00:21:49.891 --> 00:21:58.291
Pam Johnson-Bennett: And you don't want to let them out when you're not there because you don't know, even though they can't get out, you don't know if another cat or dog is going to come by.
00:21:58.831 --> 00:22:00.911
Pam Johnson-Bennett: And that could be very, very stressful.
00:22:01.051 --> 00:22:07.411
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So if you do have a catio, you want to make sure it's only when you are there and you're monitoring what's going on.
00:22:07.611 --> 00:22:07.971
Michelle Fern: Yes.
00:22:08.071 --> 00:22:18.251
Michelle Fern: And you know, this is a little bit outside the cat wonderland, but some people like to let their cats enjoy being outside, you know, like indoor-outdoor cats.
00:22:18.271 --> 00:22:21.171
Michelle Fern: They like their cats to be just outdoors roaming around.
00:22:21.191 --> 00:22:23.671
Michelle Fern: I have my personal opinion on that.
00:22:24.011 --> 00:22:25.371
Michelle Fern: But what are your thoughts?
00:22:26.071 --> 00:22:28.131
Pam Johnson-Bennett: I have very strong opinions on it.
00:22:28.151 --> 00:22:34.791
Pam Johnson-Bennett: And anyone who knows me, knows my work or read my books, knows I don't believe cats should be out roaming freely.
00:22:34.891 --> 00:22:42.131
Pam Johnson-Bennett: There are too many unsafe things between cars and poisons and mean people and cats getting lost.
00:22:42.491 --> 00:22:50.531
Pam Johnson-Bennett: I can't even imagine the level of heartbreak if my cat was outside and got hurt and couldn't get back and I didn't know where she was.
00:22:51.051 --> 00:22:55.111
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So if you want your cat to enjoy the outdoors, do it safely.
00:22:55.351 --> 00:23:08.391
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Plus if you're doing indoor activities, if you're making the indoors more interesting through the things we talked about and engaging your cat, you're giving the cat the best of the outdoors in an indoor safe environment.
00:23:09.151 --> 00:23:11.971
Pam Johnson-Bennett: I want to know where my cat is at all times.
00:23:12.391 --> 00:23:12.851
Michelle Fern: Dr.
00:23:12.871 --> 00:23:14.191
Michelle Fern: Shirley, what's your opinion?
00:23:14.511 --> 00:23:17.911
Dr. Amy Shirley: Yeah, you know, I agree with you totally, because I see so many.
00:23:18.211 --> 00:23:21.431
Dr. Amy Shirley: Unfortunately, we see the worst of the things that can happen.
00:23:21.811 --> 00:23:30.811
Dr. Amy Shirley: Even just where we live, we've had cats that are on really, really good tick prevention, and they've still gotten Cytoxonosis, which is bobcat fever.
00:23:31.551 --> 00:23:34.131
Dr. Amy Shirley: And just like you said, there's so many different hazards.
00:23:34.151 --> 00:23:42.131
Dr. Amy Shirley: And so the best thing is to keep them indoors, and it's better for the wildlife population, too, that they're not out hunting songbirds and other things.
00:23:42.391 --> 00:23:50.591
Dr. Amy Shirley: I will say that I do recommend microchipping, even if, because I have some people that say, well, my cat doesn't ever go outdoors, but you just never know.
00:23:50.611 --> 00:23:56.611
Dr. Amy Shirley: Like we've had a cat go missing while it was traveling, and six months later, it was relocated due to a microchip.
00:23:56.631 --> 00:24:02.251
Dr. Amy Shirley: It had been missing for six months and had been found and got back to the family safely.
00:24:02.431 --> 00:24:05.471
Dr. Amy Shirley: So I do recommend that as just an extra layer of protection.
00:24:05.491 --> 00:24:06.671
Pam Johnson-Bennett: I agree.
00:24:06.731 --> 00:24:16.251
Pam Johnson-Bennett: All indoor cats, because somebody could slip out a door, and many cats don't wear collars, or if they do wear collars, it can come off.
00:24:16.351 --> 00:24:18.651
Pam Johnson-Bennett: If you use the breakaway collar, it can come off.
00:24:18.691 --> 00:24:28.591
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So microchipping is safe, it's easy, it's something that's done very quickly in the veterinary clinic, and it's tremendous peace of mind.
00:24:29.351 --> 00:24:31.571
Michelle Fern: Okay, now I'll make my opinion known.
00:24:31.931 --> 00:24:33.791
Michelle Fern: I absolutely agree with both of you.
00:24:34.051 --> 00:24:38.511
Michelle Fern: I didn't want to muddy the pot by talking first, just my thought.
00:24:38.931 --> 00:24:46.511
Michelle Fern: I actually, living in South Florida, I cannot understand even, it's beyond my understanding.
00:24:46.531 --> 00:24:53.771
Michelle Fern: I can't even wrap my head around why people would let their cat outdoors when it's hot out, which you see all the time.
00:24:53.791 --> 00:25:03.351
Michelle Fern: I mean, granted, there's a lot of strays, and they're community cats, and there's not that much you could do, except maybe make them a shaded area because they're not going to be comfortable indoors.
00:25:03.711 --> 00:25:07.271
Michelle Fern: But the other thing is, there's predators, there's lots of raccoons around here.
00:25:07.291 --> 00:25:12.731
Michelle Fern: In Northern Florida, there's deer, so not a good place to have your cat outdoors.
00:25:13.011 --> 00:25:14.271
Michelle Fern: I don't think there's any place.
00:25:14.731 --> 00:25:15.291
Michelle Fern: My thought.
00:25:15.751 --> 00:25:18.291
Pam Johnson-Bennett: It's not worth the risk when you think about it.
00:25:18.651 --> 00:25:25.671
Pam Johnson-Bennett: And I know that it is a hot topic, and it is a big argument with some people who say it's cruel to keep a cat indoors.
00:25:25.971 --> 00:25:37.171
Pam Johnson-Bennett: But I think if you provide the outdoor environment indoors and engage with your cat, you are giving your cat everything that they need that they would get from the outside without any of the dangers.
00:25:37.451 --> 00:25:38.731
Pam Johnson-Bennett: You've reduced injury.
00:25:38.751 --> 00:25:45.531
Pam Johnson-Bennett: You've reduced the risk of disease, parasites, cat getting lost, stolen, abused, poisoned.
00:25:45.551 --> 00:25:47.431
Pam Johnson-Bennett: I mean, the list is endless.
00:25:47.991 --> 00:25:49.391
Michelle Fern: I absolutely agree.
00:25:49.771 --> 00:25:52.731
Michelle Fern: Thank you both so much, Pam Johnson-Bennett and Dr.
00:25:52.731 --> 00:25:54.611
Michelle Fern: Amy Shirley for coming on Cattitude.
00:25:54.811 --> 00:25:59.471
Michelle Fern: Can you tell our listeners a little bit about where they can find out more about each of you?
00:25:59.791 --> 00:26:00.231
Michelle Fern: Yeah.
00:26:00.251 --> 00:26:04.531
Dr. Amy Shirley: You can find our veterinary hospital at familypethealth.com.
00:26:04.931 --> 00:26:09.071
Dr. Amy Shirley: And you can also go on the Fear Free website to look at the bigger...
00:26:09.091 --> 00:26:16.191
Dr. Amy Shirley: Because you can find a Fear Free certified professional, maybe even a certified hospital in your area is a good place to look.
00:26:16.331 --> 00:26:20.851
Dr. Amy Shirley: And then our hospital also puts out a podcast called the Family Pet Podcast, where we...
00:26:21.231 --> 00:26:25.431
Dr. Amy Shirley: It's for pet parents, so it's for pet owners, you know, cats and dogs.
00:26:25.531 --> 00:26:30.171
Dr. Amy Shirley: And we do have a lot of medical information on there, so I just wanted to mention that as well.
00:26:30.671 --> 00:26:37.091
Pam Johnson-Bennett: My website is catbehaviorassociates.com, and you can find information about my books there.
00:26:37.431 --> 00:26:45.211
Pam Johnson-Bennett: I have a lot of articles on there, so whatever question you have, you can put in the search bar, and chances are, I have an opinion on it.
00:26:45.751 --> 00:26:49.891
Pam Johnson-Bennett: And I'm also very, very active on Facebook and Instagram.
00:26:49.971 --> 00:26:56.571
Pam Johnson-Bennett: Instagram is Think Like a Cat, and Facebook is Pam Johnson-Bennett, and I love to interact and answer questions if I can.
00:26:57.071 --> 00:27:05.271
Pam Johnson-Bennett: So I just want to get the education and have pet parents have the relationship they want with their cat, that they always dreamed about having.
00:27:05.811 --> 00:27:07.751
Michelle Fern: I hope all of you enjoyed this show.
00:27:07.951 --> 00:27:11.311
Michelle Fern: I loved having Pam Johnson-Bennett and Dr.
00:27:11.331 --> 00:27:16.311
Michelle Fern: Amy Shirley on the show and found out some great ways to keep my cats entertained.
00:27:16.651 --> 00:27:19.111
Michelle Fern: Please go to check out their website.
00:27:19.211 --> 00:27:20.491
Michelle Fern: Great information.
00:27:21.011 --> 00:27:23.851
Michelle Fern: So thank you both for coming on Cattitude.
00:27:24.251 --> 00:27:31.311
Michelle Fern: Thanks to my audience for listening to Cattitude and making it one of the most popular cat podcasts out there in the internet.
00:27:31.331 --> 00:27:32.691
Michelle Fern: I so appreciate it.
00:27:32.991 --> 00:27:41.691
Michelle Fern: Thanks to my crew, Dennis, Charlotte and Molly, for teaching me all about cats and letting me know that it is their catio.
00:27:41.851 --> 00:27:42.931
Michelle Fern: Not my patio.
00:27:43.451 --> 00:27:44.931
Michelle Fern: And I don't mind sharing it all.
00:27:45.331 --> 00:27:57.751
Michelle Fern: And of course, thanks to my producer, Mark Winter, for working his magic and making the podcast that not only my podcast, but all podcasts on Pet Life Radio, just amazing.
00:27:57.991 --> 00:28:02.631
Michelle Fern: So when you're listening to them, you hear everything as well as it can be.
00:28:02.931 --> 00:28:05.871
Michelle Fern: And hey, remember, lose the attitude... have Cattitude!
00:28:07.871 --> 00:28:13.911
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