Pets and the City
This week Michelle Fern is joined by Dr. Amy Attas - pet expert and founder of City Pets, and author of the new book, Pets and the City: True Tales of a Manhattan House Call Veterinarian. Drawing from her extensive career spanning over three decades as a house call veterinarian in New York City, Dr. Attas takes readers from Park Avenue to the city projects, sharing the shocking, sometimes heartbreaking, often funny, life-affirming experiences she has faced through her storied career, treating the cats and dogs for more than 700,000 Manhattan families. A fascinating book and an interview you won’t want to miss!
Listen to Episode #326 Now:
BIO:
Dr. Amy Attas is the founder of City Pets, a premier veterinary medical house call practice for dogs and cats living or working in or visiting Manhattan.
Dr. Attas is a graduate of Barnard College; holds both a VMD and a MA in Animal Behavior from the University of Pennsylvania; and completed her Internship in Medicine and Surgery at the prestigious Animal Medical Center in Manhattan. Additionally, she sits on the Board of her alma mater, the University of Pennsylvania School of Veterinary Medicine; is a Trustee of the EcoHealth Alliance, one of the world’s premier conservation and health organizations; and is a member of the President’s Council and is an active fundraiser for the Global Health Program of the Wildlife Conservation Society, along with many other animal-related charities.
The Veterinary Medical Association of the City of New York has awarded Dr. Attas both its Merit Award and the Award for Outstanding Service to Veterinary Medicine. She served over a decade on the Veterinary Medical Association’s Executive Board, including as the Association’s designated Liaison to the New York City government. She also served as a founding member of the President’s Science Advisory Board at Barnard College.
Amy grew up in New York. She shares a home with her husband Stephen Shapiro and their rescued pugs, Winston and Cleopatra, and she makes every effort to enjoy the many cultural events New York has to offer, from opera and theater to the New York Rangers.
She is most proud of the care and compassion she brings to her practice of veterinary medicine.
Transcript:
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Announcer: This is Pet Life Radio.
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Announcer: Let's talk pets!
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Michelle Fern: Hello, pet lovers, welcome to Best Bets for Pets.
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Michelle Fern: I'm your show host, Michelle Fern.
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Michelle Fern: And wow, this is a show you are not gonna wanna miss.
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Michelle Fern: I don't even know how to tell you how amazed I was at reading this book.
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Michelle Fern: I have the author with us today, and this is a book about pets that is unbelievably fascinating and just incredible.
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Michelle Fern: Stay tuned and we'll be right back.
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Michelle Fern: Hey, Michelle Fern here, and you know, saving cats is near and dear to my heart.
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Michelle Fern: Did you know that there is an estimated 70 to 100 million pre-roaming cats in the United States?
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Michelle Fern: And without spay neuter, that number will keep growing.
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Michelle Fern: Not only does spay neuter mainly reduce the community cat population, but it also keeps cats healthier.
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Michelle Fern: Scooter, the Neutered Cat, is on a mission to give cats an extra life by making it hip to be sniffed.
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Michelle Fern: Visit his website, givethemten.org, to help pioneer a better world for cats.
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Michelle Fern: That's GiveThemTen, spelled out, T-E-N, dot org.
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Announcer: Let's Talk Pets on petliferadio.com.
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Michelle Fern: Welcome back, everyone.
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Michelle Fern: I'd like to welcome author and veterinarian Dr.
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Michelle Fern: Amy Attas, who just recently wrote the book, Pets and the City.
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Michelle Fern: Welcome, Dr.
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Michelle Fern: Amy.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Thank you, Michelle.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I'm delighted to be here.
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Michelle Fern: I am so glad to have you on.
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Michelle Fern: I read a lot, and I read a lot of pet books, and I was riveted.
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Michelle Fern: The full title, it's Pets and the City, True Tales of Manhattan House Call Veterinarian.
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Michelle Fern: And you're also the founder of City Pets.
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Michelle Fern: So can you give us a little background about yourself?
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Dr. Amy Attas: Sure.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So as you mentioned, I'm a dog and cat veterinarian.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I practice in Manhattan.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And about three decades ago, I started a veterinary house call practice.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And that was really a novelty at that time.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Most people said you should get a real job.
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Dr. Amy Attas: This is never gonna work.
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Dr. Amy Attas: But I had the presence to think of a way that animals would be more comfortable and a way that I could deliver veterinary care at home.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And so I've been doing that for dogs and cats in New York for the past 30 some odd years and absolutely loving it.
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Michelle Fern: And you have had a lot of great stories and we'll get into some of that.
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Michelle Fern: But what made you decide to write Pets and the City?
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Dr. Amy Attas: So I've been writing this book in my head ever since I can remember.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And it really started with me coming home every day and saying to my husband, you will not believe what happened today.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And you know how you always think, I'll remember this forever.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And then the next day I was like, what was that really interesting story I wanted to remember?
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Dr. Amy Attas: So I realized I needed to write these things down.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And I don't write the whole story.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Sometimes just a sentence is all I need to capture the essence of what happened.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And then eventually it all comes back to me.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So after decades of doing this, I realized I've had so many amazing stories and I didn't want to write a book of, oh, I was a little girl, I wanted to be a vet.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And then I went to vet school and then I got my first job and then I got my second job, et cetera.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I realized that things that happened in my experiences often went together into certain themes.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And I thought that was a much more interesting way of telling the story.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Because even though I'm the only character that goes from the beginning to the end, it's not a book about me.
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Dr. Amy Attas: It's a book about the animals who I will refer to as my patients.
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Dr. Amy Attas: It's a book about the people who I refer to as my clients.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And because I'm going around Manhattan all day long in the backseat of a car, meeting doorman, dealing with traffic, crazy things that happen going in and out of buildings, the book is about Manhattan.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So it's really about those three things that turn it into a really interesting tale of the experiences I've had in my decades of being a New York City House Call Practitioner.
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Michelle Fern: What an eloquent way to describe it.
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Michelle Fern: And you have a quite witty sense of humor, which if your house called that in Manhattan, I think that's a necessity.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I joke about the fact that oftentimes I'm invisible to my clients.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And again, clients are the humans.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I'm never invisible to my patients.
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Dr. Amy Attas: They're just like any other vet.
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Dr. Amy Attas: My patients are a little afraid of me, but as I explained to people, especially the cats, they're gonna dislike me a lot less than they dislike the vet in the animal hospital because all the things you have to do to go to the animal hospital don't occur when someone's making a house call to you.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Cats don't have to go in cat carriers.
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Dr. Amy Attas: They don't have to go in the backseat of the car.
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Dr. Amy Attas: They don't have to sit in the waiting room with a barking dog.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So they're much, much calmer at home.
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Dr. Amy Attas: But I'm still gonna poke and prod them and stick them with needles.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So ultimately, I'm not their favorite person.
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Dr. Amy Attas: But again, in the scheme of things, I'm not as bad as I could be in a hospital.
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Michelle Fern: That kind of leads into it.
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Michelle Fern: I was gonna ask you, how is the house call veterinarian different than a standard veterinarian?
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Michelle Fern: I get it for cats.
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Michelle Fern: And that's a godsend for cats because cats and carriers, sometimes I've had to cancel appointments because I couldn't get my cat in the carrier.
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Michelle Fern: And I have all the tricks, but still it's mission impossible at times.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Even I've been stumped finding a cat when I know they're in the apartment and we just look everywhere.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Eventually we find them, but it does take a lot of time.
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Michelle Fern: Yes, so you even have a couple of stories in here just in dealing with your drivers, getting the right driver in Manhattan.
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Michelle Fern: But give us a little bit of a taste of what it's like.
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Michelle Fern: You know, us as pet parents, we know what it's like going to the veterinarian with our pet, not fun.
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Michelle Fern: I live in a very warm place.
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Michelle Fern: I hate taking my, when I had my dog, hated taking him to the vet when it was warm out.
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Michelle Fern: It was just uncomfortable.
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Michelle Fern: And you know, it's never a pleasant experience going to the vet, except if it's just annual shots, then it's not so bad.
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Michelle Fern: But House Call brings a whole other realm to it.
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Michelle Fern: So what are some of the differences we wouldn't expect?
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Dr. Amy Attas: So I like to explain to people that I can do on House Call pretty much anything that a veterinarian can do in the exam room.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I can do the physical exam.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I can take blood.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I can take urine.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I can vaccinate.
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Dr. Amy Attas: We can do, I can do an EKG.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I can do an ultrasound.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I can do any of those things in a client's home.
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Dr. Amy Attas: What I can't do is take an x-ray or do anything that requires anesthesia or surgery.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So those things are done in the regular animal hospital.
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Dr. Amy Attas: There's no compromise to the quality of care because we're coming to your home.
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Dr. Amy Attas: What we do bring is the convenience.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Oftentimes for my established clients, they're not even home from my visit.
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Dr. Amy Attas: If they have a very important day at work and their dog or cat doesn't feel well, their doorman can let us in because of course this is Manhattan.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Everybody lives for the most part in an apartment building.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So they either give us a set of keys, their doorman can let us in, maybe their nanny is there with their children or their housekeeper, or don't tell anyone.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Sometimes they leave the door unlocked.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So it just is an enormous convenience for people.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So we can come in and I say we because we're a team.
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Dr. Amy Attas: On every house call, there's a driver who brings us around Manhattan because it would be impossible to do this if I had to drive my own car and park it or take a taxi or an Uber because we carry too much equipment.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And then I go with a nurse.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So there's somebody helping me with each call.
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Dr. Amy Attas: That maximizes the efficiency and we can get things done pretty much within approximately a half an hour would be the normal timeframe for a house call visit.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So if the client, the human can't be home, we'll have a conversation beforehand on the telephone.
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Dr. Amy Attas: We'll be in touch with each other via texting, email, phone calls, whatever they want.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So they can give me the full history and I can ask whatever follow-up questions I need to.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And then I complete the entire physical exam in taking the laboratory samples, et cetera.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Every once in a while, this is not a perfect system.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I think you'll recall the story in the book where my client thought that her cat had a respiratory infection, a cold, because her sister's cat had a cold and she thought it had similar symptoms.
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Dr. Amy Attas: But what she was interpreting as a little bit of a stuffy nose was actually her cat having difficulty breathing and her cat did not have a respiratory infection.
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Dr. Amy Attas: It actually had a heart condition and had fluid building up in its lungs.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So I went to make that house call without the client being home and found the cat really compromised in the bathroom, behind the toilet, having incredible difficulty breathing.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And I was unable to reach the client and I had no choice but to do what I did.
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Dr. Amy Attas: We went through her closets until we found her cat carrier and I took the cat with me back to the hospital.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Ironically, it was a day like you described, you hate taking your pets out on a really, really hot and humid day.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And this was a very, very hot and humid day in New York City.
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Dr. Amy Attas: We were stuck in traffic.
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Dr. Amy Attas: The air conditioning just wasn't enough to keep this cat comfortable.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And I wound up running the last few blocks to the hospital to get the cat into air conditioning and in fact, into oxygen as quickly as possible.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So sometimes what people think is not a big deal, turns out to be a big deal.
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Dr. Amy Attas: But most of the time, what people think is a big deal turns out not to be.
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Michelle Fern: Very interesting.
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Michelle Fern: As you said in your book, you do also go have themes with the route and we'll touch on a couple after the break.
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Michelle Fern: But what I found was, and of course it was entertaining, so entertaining.
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Michelle Fern: We talked about this a little before we started, but I really think that this is a must read.
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Michelle Fern: It doesn't matter if you have a pet at all.
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Michelle Fern: If you like to read, if you can read, you should get this book because it's a fascinating book.
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Michelle Fern: Dr.
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Michelle Fern: Amy, this is incredible.
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Michelle Fern: I hope Netflix is listening because this would be a great show, great series, different from everything else that they keep redoing.
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Michelle Fern: Anyway, what are some of the few surprising things that you found out when you became a house call veterinarian besides the, I guess the glimpse into some of these amazing homes?
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Dr. Amy Attas: Well, I think you really, you talked about the essence of the book.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Even though the way I'm in this world is through the pets, this is a book about people.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I have been witness to people's lives, to their families.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I have been doing this for so long that I came into the household, perhaps when children were very young and then watched them grow up and then they went off on their own, they married, they had their own children and I continue my relationship with them through their pets.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And you really get to know people so much more when you're in their home rather than being in an animal hospital with them where it's a completely different relationship.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So it's very, very personal.
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Dr. Amy Attas: Having said that, sometimes it's a little too personal and sometimes, you know, Joe can say that I don't just show up in people's homes, they make an appointment and they know that I'm coming.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So I'm surprised sometimes at what is left out in the home that probably I shouldn't be seeing.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And I do tell a few of those stories in the book.
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Dr. Amy Attas: But it's again, for those who maybe thought they might not find anything of interest about a book written by a veterinarian, this is a book about people, it's a book about pets, and it's also about my beloved New York City because I have to go around the city every single day, you know, when the UN General Assembly is in session and we can't get through the streets and we're racing to get to an emergency, it becomes a challenge that is different from what other veterinarians go through.
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Michelle Fern: Well, we're going to take a short break and we'll be right back and talk more about your book.
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Michelle Fern: We'll be right back.
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Michelle Fern: Let's Talk Pets on Pet Life Radio.
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Michelle Fern: Welcome back, everyone.
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Michelle Fern: We're talking with Dr.
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Michelle Fern: Amy Attas, and she's a veterinarian.
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Michelle Fern: She is the founder of City Pets, and she wrote the book Pets and the City.
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Michelle Fern: And Dr.
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Michelle Fern: Amy, I learned things I had no idea about in your book.
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Michelle Fern: And we're just gonna touch on a couple of stories, if that's okay, and not even go all into detail, because people need to read this book.
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Michelle Fern: It's wildly entertaining, and there's themes throughout that really make you think, as a pet parent, oh, you know what, I should be better, I should be doing that, or I should give thought to this.
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Michelle Fern: One of the things I found that blew my mind is the story of the gentleman that didn't want to neuter his dog.
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Dr. Amy Attas: So it's a true story.
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Michelle Fern: With the fake balls?
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Michelle Fern: I didn't know they had such a thing.
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Dr. Amy Attas: I don't think this is the finest moment of veterinary medicine, that there is such a thing as prosthetic testicles.
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Dr. Amy Attas: But and it's not something that I recommend, but in this particular instance, with a male dog whose family just didn't want him to be neutered.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And I shouldn't actually say his family, but his macho dad didn't want him to be neutered.
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Dr. Amy Attas: But the important point here is that their previous dog died of prostate cancer.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And we can pretty much eliminate prostate cancer in veterinary medicine by neutering male dogs.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And they also have an enormous number of medical issues as they get older.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And by the way, this is no different from older men, they get prostate issues.
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Dr. Amy Attas: But in dogs, we have this convenient way to eliminate the problem.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And the wife really did want to have the dog neutered, the husband didn't.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And I believe that the reason the husband didn't want him neutered is he didn't like the way he would look aesthetically.
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Dr. Amy Attas: And this was an instance where the wife gave documentation that she was the rightful owner of the dog.
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Dr. Amy Attas: She signed the papers from the breeder.
00:15:37.733 --> 00:15:43.193
Dr. Amy Attas: And she asked us to have the dog neutered and implant these prosthetic testicles.
00:15:43.473 --> 00:15:51.873
Dr. Amy Attas: And I don't know to this day if the husband ever knew whether those testicles were real or not, but he seemed happy, she was happy.
00:15:51.893 --> 00:15:57.893
Dr. Amy Attas: And as the veterinarian, I was very happy that this dog would not develop prostate disease later on in life.
00:15:58.293 --> 00:16:13.873
Dr. Amy Attas: So that was just a one-off, but it was an example of sometimes people are more interested in what they perceive their dog to be rather than the true health and wellbeing of the dog.
00:16:14.173 --> 00:16:16.513
Dr. Amy Attas: And this was just a way of working around that.
00:16:16.753 --> 00:16:19.793
Michelle Fern: You said it a lot better than I did prosthetic testicles.
00:16:20.073 --> 00:16:24.993
Michelle Fern: I just put my notes, fake balls, but it was a great way to solve the problem.
00:16:25.173 --> 00:16:32.993
Michelle Fern: You also have had a lot of celebrity clients and some of the stories about is it okay if I say the name?
00:16:33.013 --> 00:16:37.413
Dr. Amy Attas: Of course, every celebrity in the book is in the book with their permission.
00:16:37.813 --> 00:16:49.533
Michelle Fern: Okay, well, of course, it's a printed book, but Joan Rivers, Bunny and Billy Joel, oh, I'm a huge fan, but how did you get past the wow moments and then his wife at the time, Katie Lee?
00:16:49.793 --> 00:17:01.213
Michelle Fern: And I know there were other celebrities as well, even royalty, but how did you get past the, oh my gosh, I'm in Billy's, I'm taking care of Billy Joel's dog or Joan Rivers Yorkie?
00:17:01.413 --> 00:17:07.553
Dr. Amy Attas: So there's always a wow factor because these people are just so fabulous at what they do.
00:17:07.933 --> 00:17:13.753
Dr. Amy Attas: So it's okay to just really appreciate them as being great in what they do.
00:17:14.113 --> 00:17:17.673
Dr. Amy Attas: However, it all boils down to the pet that I'm caring for.
00:17:17.733 --> 00:17:20.313
Dr. Amy Attas: So you get over that wow factor pretty quickly.
00:17:20.613 --> 00:17:26.973
Dr. Amy Attas: Now, I'm not gonna lie and say I don't get excited when my phone rings and it's one of these great celebrities.
00:17:27.333 --> 00:17:30.373
Dr. Amy Attas: I'm just so honored that they trust me to care for their pets.
00:17:30.933 --> 00:17:34.493
Dr. Amy Attas: Joan Rivers was one of my first clients.
00:17:34.673 --> 00:17:37.293
Dr. Amy Attas: I met her when I was a young veterinarian.
00:17:37.593 --> 00:17:40.553
Dr. Amy Attas: And when I started my practice, she was my biggest booster.
00:17:40.973 --> 00:17:45.433
Dr. Amy Attas: And I continued to care for her pets for the rest of her life.
00:17:45.993 --> 00:17:53.733
Dr. Amy Attas: And I continue to care for her pets because she left instructions that that was to be the case if she pre-deceased them.
00:17:53.793 --> 00:17:55.553
Dr. Amy Attas: So I still care for her two dogs.
00:17:57.253 --> 00:18:01.033
Michelle Fern: She had some very funny comments, but you guys have to get the book.
00:18:01.233 --> 00:18:01.813
Dr. Amy Attas: Exactly.
00:18:01.833 --> 00:18:02.853
Dr. Amy Attas: We can't tell everything.
00:18:02.873 --> 00:18:03.913
Michelle Fern: Can't tell all of them.
00:18:04.153 --> 00:18:10.393
Michelle Fern: And you also had some great stories and we're going to generalize here about the uber wealthy.
00:18:10.713 --> 00:18:15.893
Michelle Fern: And some of the things I read, I thought, okay, so that's why they're so wealthy.
00:18:15.913 --> 00:18:19.193
Michelle Fern: They don't want to spend the money, especially the one with the restaurant.
00:18:19.413 --> 00:18:21.393
Michelle Fern: You guys get the book and read that story.
00:18:21.613 --> 00:18:26.633
Michelle Fern: But how do you find the uber wealthy so different when it comes to their pets?
00:18:26.653 --> 00:18:28.593
Michelle Fern: Are they a lot different than the rest of us?
00:18:28.853 --> 00:18:30.793
Dr. Amy Attas: I think pets are the great equalizers.
00:18:31.173 --> 00:18:38.173
Dr. Amy Attas: I think the billionaire clients that I have and the people who live in housing projects, ultimately they're all the same.
00:18:38.553 --> 00:18:44.793
Dr. Amy Attas: If they call me, they love their pets and they should all be treated with the same amount of respect in that regard.
00:18:44.833 --> 00:18:49.473
Dr. Amy Attas: So, I don't want people to think that my practice is made up of rich people.
00:18:49.493 --> 00:18:53.033
Dr. Amy Attas: Because I do house calls, people think this is like a concierge service.
00:18:53.533 --> 00:18:54.953
Dr. Amy Attas: And it really is not.
00:18:55.233 --> 00:19:01.213
Dr. Amy Attas: You know, we try to price ourselves in a manner that is not too expensive for average people.
00:19:01.793 --> 00:19:15.393
Dr. Amy Attas: Once we explain to them that, you know, especially if they have multiple pets, everything sort of averages out and it's more efficient with their time and more efficient with their pocketbooks if they have all their pets seen at one time.
00:19:15.653 --> 00:19:24.993
Dr. Amy Attas: So having said that, yes, I see billionaires, I see normal people, I see people who are celebrities and I see people who are just barely getting by.
00:19:25.313 --> 00:19:30.973
Dr. Amy Attas: Ultimately, once you get over the introduction and who they are, it's about the animals.
00:19:31.233 --> 00:19:36.113
Dr. Amy Attas: Some of the extremes, the homes of the billionaires can be so over the top.
00:19:36.513 --> 00:19:41.993
Dr. Amy Attas: And on the other end, some of the places I go to, you really don't want to go back there again.
00:19:42.013 --> 00:19:44.373
Dr. Amy Attas: I have seen every extreme.
00:19:44.593 --> 00:19:47.153
Dr. Amy Attas: And ultimately, that's what people are about, right?
00:19:47.173 --> 00:19:48.753
Dr. Amy Attas: We're all unique.
00:19:49.173 --> 00:19:53.373
Dr. Amy Attas: And I have been witnessed to that through caring for their pets.
00:19:53.893 --> 00:19:57.673
Dr. Amy Attas: I do see the greatest art collections you can imagine.
00:19:57.953 --> 00:20:05.173
Dr. Amy Attas: You know, this is like going through a private museum because some of my clients are such notable collectors.
00:20:05.193 --> 00:20:14.933
Dr. Amy Attas: And when you're looking for that cat who wants to hide and you get to go through the living room and the salon and the library, et cetera, I do get to see some amazing art.
00:20:15.653 --> 00:20:21.113
Dr. Amy Attas: And I've also had to go underneath beds that haven't been vacuumed in a decade.
00:20:21.153 --> 00:20:22.673
Dr. Amy Attas: So I see it all.
00:20:22.993 --> 00:20:25.133
Michelle Fern: But you're right, the great equalizer is the pet.
00:20:25.293 --> 00:20:31.313
Michelle Fern: And the pet doesn't know that, oh, their human is wealthy or not wealthy.
00:20:31.353 --> 00:20:32.933
Michelle Fern: They just know that they're loved.
00:20:33.213 --> 00:20:38.013
Dr. Amy Attas: So in the first chapter, I talk about Gail and her cat, Sweetie.
00:20:38.473 --> 00:20:40.013
Dr. Amy Attas: And Gail was a hoarder.
00:20:40.393 --> 00:20:44.533
Dr. Amy Attas: And this apartment was very, very difficult to be in.
00:20:44.533 --> 00:20:52.153
Dr. Amy Attas: In fact, I chose sometimes to conduct my physical exam of Sweetie in the hallway, just because I didn't want to go back into the apartment.
00:20:52.793 --> 00:21:00.733
Dr. Amy Attas: And when I would see the two of them together, Sweetie loved her mom so much.
00:21:00.933 --> 00:21:04.293
Dr. Amy Attas: And the two of them got so much pleasure from each other.
00:21:04.313 --> 00:21:07.273
Dr. Amy Attas: And it's like, you know what, I continue to go there.
00:21:07.373 --> 00:21:14.033
Dr. Amy Attas: And oftentimes my visits, of course they were because Sweetie needed help, but Gail needed some help too.
00:21:14.053 --> 00:21:21.973
Dr. Amy Attas: And whether that was as a friend or someone who she just knew was looking out for her wellbeing, I think that gave her a great deal of comfort.
00:21:22.373 --> 00:21:23.273
Michelle Fern: I think you're right.
00:21:23.373 --> 00:21:27.713
Michelle Fern: And you did follow her story through, you know, other parts of the book.
00:21:27.913 --> 00:21:32.873
Michelle Fern: And it was kind of incredible reading about that and that relationship.
00:21:33.193 --> 00:21:42.673
Michelle Fern: You also do a great job of matchmaking with, you know, dogs that, you know, that are abandoned or there's some situation.
00:21:42.693 --> 00:21:50.633
Michelle Fern: Cause can you, you know, I think you're on a speed dial for some of the shelters to where you've done this amazing matchmaking.
00:21:51.013 --> 00:21:54.093
Michelle Fern: Is that a skill that you just developed over the years?
00:21:54.393 --> 00:21:59.293
Michelle Fern: You know, you found no of this dog and this person, and they would just go great together.
00:21:59.473 --> 00:22:01.973
Dr. Amy Attas: I think it was a necessary skill for me again.
00:22:01.993 --> 00:22:03.653
Dr. Amy Attas: I'm in my client's homes.
00:22:04.093 --> 00:22:07.653
Dr. Amy Attas: So, you know, for example, there's a story in the book about Mrs.
00:22:07.653 --> 00:22:08.133
Dr. Amy Attas: Blum.
00:22:08.553 --> 00:22:13.693
Dr. Amy Attas: She's a very elderly woman with a very old dog who passed away.
00:22:14.493 --> 00:22:24.493
Dr. Amy Attas: And because I had known her for years and I had been in her home, I felt that I needed to go visit her after her dog passed away rather than just call her on the phone.
00:22:24.953 --> 00:22:32.153
Dr. Amy Attas: And when I went to see her, I was just shocked at the deterioration in her condition in the few days after her dog had passed.
00:22:32.553 --> 00:22:33.873
Dr. Amy Attas: She was still wearing a nightgown.
00:22:33.913 --> 00:22:36.513
Dr. Amy Attas: I had never seen her in a nightgown before this.
00:22:36.533 --> 00:22:39.713
Dr. Amy Attas: She was always dressed with her hairbrushed makeup on.
00:22:39.993 --> 00:22:42.533
Dr. Amy Attas: She was, it was like a social visit when I went over.
00:22:43.093 --> 00:22:48.213
Dr. Amy Attas: She looked gaunt when I asked her when she ate last, she wasn't sure.
00:22:48.933 --> 00:22:58.273
Dr. Amy Attas: And I realized at that moment that truly what was keeping her alive was her dog, being responsible for feeding and walking and caring for her dog.
00:22:58.613 --> 00:23:07.853
Dr. Amy Attas: And now that the dog was gone, this woman was in her nineties, her husband was gone, her friends were gone, I felt that she didn't have anything left to live for.
00:23:08.313 --> 00:23:18.953
Dr. Amy Attas: And this was an emergency call to every single shelter group I knew, you need to help me find an older, small poodle with a good personality.
00:23:19.453 --> 00:23:25.393
Dr. Amy Attas: And they came through in a few days and I went back to her house without saying a word and had the dog with me.
00:23:26.173 --> 00:23:29.293
Dr. Amy Attas: And she looked at me like, why is that dog here?
00:23:29.333 --> 00:23:30.333
Dr. Amy Attas: I don't want a dog.
00:23:30.673 --> 00:23:32.433
Dr. Amy Attas: And I said, it's not about you, Mrs.
00:23:32.433 --> 00:23:33.893
Dr. Amy Attas: Blum, it's about the dog.
00:23:34.133 --> 00:23:36.033
Dr. Amy Attas: I have no place to put this dog.
00:23:36.073 --> 00:23:37.593
Dr. Amy Attas: It's gonna go into a shelter.
00:23:37.613 --> 00:23:38.913
Dr. Amy Attas: It might be put to sleep.
00:23:39.153 --> 00:23:43.973
Dr. Amy Attas: Can you just take care of the dog for a day or two until I can find a home?
00:23:44.813 --> 00:23:49.433
Dr. Amy Attas: I don't want to admit this to everybody listening, but that was a complete fabrication.
00:23:49.453 --> 00:23:52.473
Dr. Amy Attas: I mean, I begged to get this dog.
00:23:52.753 --> 00:23:58.073
Dr. Amy Attas: And of course, when I went back the next day, she said, you were so right to bring him to me.
00:23:58.413 --> 00:23:59.893
Dr. Amy Attas: He really needed help.
00:24:00.233 --> 00:24:04.533
Dr. Amy Attas: And of course, he had helped her so much in just the few hours he'd been there.
00:24:04.933 --> 00:24:15.433
Dr. Amy Attas: And I don't know if I would have known so much about her need if my only experience with her was in an examination room of an animal hospital.
00:24:15.833 --> 00:24:17.673
Dr. Amy Attas: This was because it was personal.
00:24:18.333 --> 00:24:22.253
Dr. Amy Attas: And that's what I love about how I practice veterinary medicine.
00:24:22.713 --> 00:24:25.833
Dr. Amy Attas: You know, I love the animals, but I love the people too.
00:24:26.173 --> 00:24:28.793
Dr. Amy Attas: And I feel like I can provide a service for them as well.
00:24:29.013 --> 00:24:32.093
Michelle Fern: I remember that story and that happened.
00:24:32.293 --> 00:24:34.173
Michelle Fern: There are a few stories like that in your book.
00:24:34.733 --> 00:24:41.333
Michelle Fern: And thinking of you're helping the pet, of course, from being most cases probably shelter and euthanize.
00:24:41.633 --> 00:24:51.273
Michelle Fern: But how much are you helping these people with their lives and possibly even extending their lives, definitely bringing more joy to their lives?
00:24:51.733 --> 00:24:56.773
Dr. Amy Attas: So in this example that I gave you, I know 100% this was for the women's benefit.
00:24:57.153 --> 00:25:01.253
Dr. Amy Attas: I mean, this little toy poodle that I got her, he was on everybody's top list.
00:25:01.353 --> 00:25:05.393
Dr. Amy Attas: Everybody wanted him, but I was like, no, no, no, this is a life-saving adoption.
00:25:05.413 --> 00:25:10.493
Dr. Amy Attas: If we can make this happen, this woman is gonna go back to caring about whether she lives or dies.
00:25:10.793 --> 00:25:14.633
Dr. Amy Attas: So this was all about her and she provided him an amazing life.
00:25:15.093 --> 00:25:16.393
Dr. Amy Attas: She pre-deceased him.
00:25:16.753 --> 00:25:22.233
Dr. Amy Attas: And then he wound up at a forever home after that, but he was with her for two and a half years.
00:25:22.393 --> 00:25:27.153
Dr. Amy Attas: And I don't think she would have lived two and a half more years if she didn't have him in her life.
00:25:27.373 --> 00:25:28.913
Michelle Fern: No, I think you're right.
00:25:29.133 --> 00:25:31.593
Michelle Fern: You talk about something at the end of the book.
00:25:31.753 --> 00:25:33.373
Michelle Fern: It's one of my peeves.
00:25:33.373 --> 00:25:36.033
Michelle Fern: You talk about decks and the puppy mills.
00:25:36.413 --> 00:25:44.453
Michelle Fern: You could probably mention it a lot more eloquently than I can, but there's so much that goes wrong with pets and pet stores.
00:25:44.473 --> 00:25:46.873
Dr. Amy Attas: So let's just explain to everyone.
00:25:46.913 --> 00:25:50.213
Dr. Amy Attas: I even hate the term puppy mill because it sounds so cute.
00:25:50.473 --> 00:25:56.353
Dr. Amy Attas: I mean, this is factory farming of dogs, where the dogs are kept in horrific conditions.
00:25:56.513 --> 00:25:59.413
Dr. Amy Attas: The females are just used to breed and breed and breed.
00:25:59.853 --> 00:26:04.013
Dr. Amy Attas: And then when they're of no use any longer, their lives are ended.
00:26:04.393 --> 00:26:08.913
Dr. Amy Attas: So, you know, there's no care in the genetics of the offspring.
00:26:08.973 --> 00:26:10.753
Dr. Amy Attas: It's really all about making money.
00:26:11.393 --> 00:26:19.933
Dr. Amy Attas: And I like people to realize that if you're going to, you know, a pet store, most likely these animals came from factory farming.
00:26:20.913 --> 00:26:24.473
Dr. Amy Attas: And the problem is, you can't ever go in a pet store.
00:26:24.753 --> 00:26:33.853
Dr. Amy Attas: Because once you do and you catch the eye of an individual animal, you're immediately in love and you feel like you have to rescue that animal.
00:26:34.113 --> 00:26:35.973
Dr. Amy Attas: And that's what people say to me all the time.
00:26:36.313 --> 00:26:37.573
Dr. Amy Attas: I adopted my dog.
00:26:37.593 --> 00:26:37.973
Dr. Amy Attas: Oh, really?
00:26:37.993 --> 00:26:38.633
Dr. Amy Attas: Where did you get it from?
00:26:38.653 --> 00:26:39.733
Dr. Amy Attas: I got it from the pet store.
00:26:39.753 --> 00:26:40.913
Dr. Amy Attas: I rescued my dog.
00:26:40.933 --> 00:26:41.713
Dr. Amy Attas: Where did you get it from?
00:26:41.793 --> 00:26:42.713
Dr. Amy Attas: From the pet store.
00:26:42.953 --> 00:26:45.933
Dr. Amy Attas: It is rescuing that individual animal.
00:26:46.273 --> 00:26:49.553
Dr. Amy Attas: But what it's doing is continuing this whole process.
00:26:49.673 --> 00:26:55.513
Dr. Amy Attas: Every time they get money, there's a reason for them to continue factory farming of animals.
00:26:55.993 --> 00:27:00.593
Dr. Amy Attas: So in the case that you're talking about this little dog, it was a miniature dachshund.
00:27:00.993 --> 00:27:11.813
Dr. Amy Attas: He came to me from another hospital where he was brought to be euthanized because the pet store owner didn't want to spend money on a veterinary visit when the puppy was sick.
00:27:12.173 --> 00:27:13.913
Dr. Amy Attas: And he thought he knew what he was doing.
00:27:14.213 --> 00:27:18.733
Dr. Amy Attas: So he decided to give the same injection that he had always seen the veterinarian give.
00:27:19.153 --> 00:27:20.533
Dr. Amy Attas: And he did that to the dog.
00:27:20.553 --> 00:27:22.353
Dr. Amy Attas: And of course, it was the wrong injection.
00:27:22.773 --> 00:27:28.413
Dr. Amy Attas: And it caused all of the dog's skin to become diseased and ultimately become necrotic.
00:27:28.433 --> 00:27:30.113
Dr. Amy Attas: And actually the skin died.
00:27:30.753 --> 00:27:43.653
Dr. Amy Attas: And so I got the dog and said I would do my best to see if I could, you know, carry him through this period of time with antibiotics and pain medicine and supportive care and ultimately skin grafts.
00:27:44.013 --> 00:27:46.913
Dr. Amy Attas: And this dog made a 100% recovery.
00:27:47.253 --> 00:27:54.533
Dr. Amy Attas: The injection that they gave him that was incorrect was an injection of a concentrated sugar solution called 50% dextrose.
00:27:54.933 --> 00:28:01.373
Dr. Amy Attas: So I named him Dex because all of my rescues get named for the circumstance that brought them to me.
00:28:01.693 --> 00:28:03.053
Dr. Amy Attas: So this was little Dex.
00:28:03.573 --> 00:28:06.933
Dr. Amy Attas: Dex ultimately went to a fantastic forever home.
00:28:08.013 --> 00:28:19.713
Dr. Amy Attas: And he was also very good news for me because I had happened to photograph him every single day that he was under my care because it was the most amazing case I had ever seen.
00:28:19.733 --> 00:28:26.013
Dr. Amy Attas: And ultimately I wrote him up and won a grand competition that sent me to Hawaii to present the case.
00:28:26.533 --> 00:28:30.513
Dr. Amy Attas: So Dex got a good life and I got a great trip to Hawaii.
00:28:30.773 --> 00:28:33.693
Michelle Fern: I'm so happy for you and a great story.
00:28:33.693 --> 00:28:45.113
Michelle Fern: And you also mentioned too that a lot of these factory farmed dogs because of the problems that they have end up, people don't want to care for all of the issues they have.
00:28:45.133 --> 00:28:46.713
Michelle Fern: So they end up at shelters.
00:28:47.093 --> 00:28:48.913
Michelle Fern: Is there a stat that you're aware of?
00:28:48.933 --> 00:28:49.533
Michelle Fern: Is that why?
00:28:49.553 --> 00:28:55.913
Dr. Amy Attas: I just want to be careful what we emphasize here because ultimately I do want people to go to shelters.
00:28:55.913 --> 00:28:56.273
Michelle Fern: Yes.
00:28:56.533 --> 00:29:05.793
Dr. Amy Attas: And sometimes it's an expectation of someone who spends a few thousand dollars on a dog and then realizes, oh, it's got this problem and oh my God, I have to train it too.
00:29:05.853 --> 00:29:08.353
Dr. Amy Attas: It's more than I can handle and they wind up in shelters.
00:29:08.993 --> 00:29:12.033
Dr. Amy Attas: Every single pet I've ever had in my life has been a rescue.
00:29:12.273 --> 00:29:17.153
Dr. Amy Attas: Two of my dogs actually came from, most likely from pet stores.
00:29:17.653 --> 00:29:21.553
Dr. Amy Attas: I don't want you to think there's an epidemic of blindness in pug dogs.
00:29:21.573 --> 00:29:26.853
Dr. Amy Attas: I just happen to love pugs and two of my pugs were blind.
00:29:27.153 --> 00:29:34.293
Dr. Amy Attas: One was literally from the pet store that was about to euthanize him because they realized they couldn't actually sell a blind dog.
00:29:34.773 --> 00:29:41.273
Dr. Amy Attas: And I took him and his predecessor was a dog I found on my way into veterinary school one day.
00:29:41.293 --> 00:29:48.073
Dr. Amy Attas: I walked over because he was a cute little pug tied to a tree and I saw a note that said, I am blind, please take good care of me.
00:29:48.393 --> 00:29:55.453
Dr. Amy Attas: Now, of course, it was a little harder to care for a blind dog than it would be for a sighted dog, but I wouldn't have traded that for anything.
00:29:55.473 --> 00:30:08.073
Dr. Amy Attas: They were both amazing dogs, just slightly more difficult to train, and I had to spend a little more attention just making sure they didn't get themselves into trouble, but completely amazing dogs.
00:30:08.133 --> 00:30:15.613
Dr. Amy Attas: And most people who met them, and they didn't overlap in time, they were years apart, but I had the same occurrence with both.
00:30:15.813 --> 00:30:18.593
Dr. Amy Attas: People who met them didn't realize that they were blind.
00:30:18.873 --> 00:30:21.273
Dr. Amy Attas: That's how normal they were.
00:30:21.713 --> 00:30:23.753
Dr. Amy Attas: So just a shout out to everyone.
00:30:23.993 --> 00:30:35.653
Dr. Amy Attas: Even if you are in love with a particular breed of dog, if you put a little time and effort into it, you can rescue, you can save a life in the breed that you like best.
00:30:36.113 --> 00:30:48.773
Michelle Fern: Yes, and where I was wrong before is not all purebreds in, I kind of led toward this, so to clarify, not all purebreds that are in shelters are definitely from factory farming.
00:30:48.893 --> 00:30:55.313
Michelle Fern: Sometimes you're right there, there because the family can't take care of them, or who knows what.
00:30:55.673 --> 00:31:03.273
Michelle Fern: But we shouldn't overlook those special dogs and cats that maybe aren't perfect, but they need their forever homes too.
00:31:03.473 --> 00:31:10.113
Dr. Amy Attas: So there's a chapter in the book that I call There's No Such Thing as a Disabled Pet, because they don't know they're disabled.
00:31:10.193 --> 00:31:18.113
Dr. Amy Attas: They are such an inspiration to all of us that they deal with what they have to deal with, and they're just truly amazing.
00:31:18.133 --> 00:31:26.973
Dr. Amy Attas: My own two dogs, my first one, okay, sort of a warped sense of humor, but I named him Bumper, because until I trained him, he bumped into everything.
00:31:27.693 --> 00:31:33.373
Dr. Amy Attas: My second blind dog, I named Leonardo, after Leonardo da Vinci, because he was truly a genius.
00:31:33.573 --> 00:31:41.753
Dr. Amy Attas: He would go hiking with us off leash and knew up, down, over, under, left, right, careful, and would stop on a dime with given the right command.
00:31:41.993 --> 00:31:43.913
Dr. Amy Attas: Truly amazing dogs.
00:31:44.273 --> 00:31:45.133
Michelle Fern: Incredible.
00:31:45.513 --> 00:31:47.833
Michelle Fern: As I mentioned, I know a couple of times, Dr.
00:31:47.833 --> 00:31:50.333
Michelle Fern: Amy, but this is really an incredible book.
00:31:50.793 --> 00:31:55.993
Michelle Fern: I hope you write part two, or I don't know, changed up the title, Pets and the City.
00:31:56.313 --> 00:31:58.873
Michelle Fern: I don't know, but I'm looking forward to the second book.
00:31:59.033 --> 00:31:59.513
Dr. Amy Attas: Thank you.
00:31:59.533 --> 00:32:06.293
Michelle Fern: For this book, what are some key points that you hope people get once they've finished reading your book?
00:32:06.813 --> 00:32:27.573
Dr. Amy Attas: So I tried to do a mix of stories, that there are some funny stories, there are some poignant or sad stories, but I also tried to put a little bit of information, knowledge, at-home dangers, things that I've noticed throughout the years that I could share with people that maybe could make them better pet owners.
00:32:28.273 --> 00:32:40.053
Dr. Amy Attas: So things like, it's a beautiful day here today, and you're inclined the first nice days of spring and summer to open your windows without realizing how dangerous that could be for pets inside.
00:32:40.473 --> 00:32:47.413
Dr. Amy Attas: And when I go into people's homes and I see windows open or doors to terraces open, I immediately close them and talk about dangers.
00:32:47.873 --> 00:32:58.433
Dr. Amy Attas: The same is true for drapery cords that are hanging down that are strangle hazards, or certain flowers like lilies are so toxic to cats.
00:32:58.833 --> 00:33:04.353
Dr. Amy Attas: The petal, the leaf, the stamen, the water that the flower sits in are all poisonous.
00:33:04.373 --> 00:33:07.133
Dr. Amy Attas: And I don't mean poisonous like you might get a little upset stomach.
00:33:07.453 --> 00:33:11.613
Dr. Amy Attas: I mean poisonous like you get kidney failure and you die.
00:33:11.633 --> 00:33:17.813
Dr. Amy Attas: So I tried to put some educational things in, but this is not a how to care for your pet book.
00:33:17.973 --> 00:33:26.313
Dr. Amy Attas: I tell the story of a woman who was a physician who had seen me use people medicine over and over again on her pets, including her dog who had cancer.
00:33:26.713 --> 00:33:30.453
Dr. Amy Attas: And I use the same chemotherapy that's used in human oncology.
00:33:30.693 --> 00:33:36.453
Dr. Amy Attas: And so she decided to give her dog a bunch of Tylenol because it was limping rather than call for a vet visit.
00:33:36.773 --> 00:33:41.093
Dr. Amy Attas: And Tylenol is so toxic to dogs and deadly to cats.
00:33:41.353 --> 00:33:49.653
Dr. Amy Attas: So I felt that in telling this story, I could also share with people that pick up the phone and call your vet if your pet has a medical problem.
00:33:49.673 --> 00:33:51.133
Dr. Amy Attas: Don't take it upon yourself.
00:33:51.253 --> 00:33:55.113
Dr. Amy Attas: Don't assume that dogs are like little people or cats are like little dogs.
00:33:55.313 --> 00:33:56.353
Dr. Amy Attas: They're all different.
00:33:56.713 --> 00:34:00.213
Dr. Amy Attas: And what's safe for one isn't necessarily safe for the others.
00:34:00.613 --> 00:34:02.153
Michelle Fern: Well, again, I applaud you.
00:34:02.173 --> 00:34:03.933
Michelle Fern: This is just an incredible book.
00:34:04.193 --> 00:34:08.013
Michelle Fern: After talking to you today, I think it's everything you wanted to be.
00:34:08.433 --> 00:34:09.633
Michelle Fern: It's educational.
00:34:10.053 --> 00:34:14.833
Michelle Fern: And through storytelling, it's informative, it's interesting.
00:34:15.413 --> 00:34:21.533
Michelle Fern: And I think it will help people and possibly get more pets adopted.
00:34:21.553 --> 00:34:22.473
Dr. Amy Attas: I hope so.
00:34:22.593 --> 00:34:23.533
Michelle Fern: That's always good.
00:34:24.273 --> 00:34:27.033
Michelle Fern: Okay, at this point, is there anything you wanted to add?
00:34:27.233 --> 00:34:32.473
Dr. Amy Attas: So the only thing I would add is that this whole journey that I've had has not been a straight line.
00:34:32.493 --> 00:34:34.433
Dr. Amy Attas: It was kind of a circuitous one.
00:34:34.973 --> 00:34:39.653
Dr. Amy Attas: But the thing is, from day one, I knew I wanted to become a veterinarian.
00:34:40.273 --> 00:34:49.913
Dr. Amy Attas: And I just realized that my unique talent of wanting it to be a personal way to do it presented some challenges and I figured out how to do that.
00:34:50.453 --> 00:35:06.813
Dr. Amy Attas: So for anybody out there listening who is passionate about animals, who might be interested in pursuing a career in veterinary medicine, do it with 100% of your energy and make it happen because it is by far the world's greatest career.
00:35:07.113 --> 00:35:08.393
Michelle Fern: Thank you so much.
00:35:08.593 --> 00:35:11.053
Michelle Fern: So where can people find Pets and the City?
00:35:11.233 --> 00:35:15.313
Dr. Amy Attas: So please go to your local bookstore and buy it there.
00:35:15.333 --> 00:35:17.533
Dr. Amy Attas: If they don't have it, ask them to order it.
00:35:18.393 --> 00:35:22.173
Dr. Amy Attas: If for any reason you have to have it immediately, it's available at Amazon.
00:35:22.193 --> 00:35:23.993
Dr. Amy Attas: It's available at Barnes and Noble.
00:35:24.353 --> 00:35:27.713
Dr. Amy Attas: It's also out as an audiobook and on Kindle.
00:35:28.193 --> 00:35:28.333
Michelle Fern: Dr.
00:35:28.353 --> 00:35:30.493
Michelle Fern: Amy, I want to thank you so much for coming on.
00:35:30.673 --> 00:35:31.773
Michelle Fern: I appreciate it.
00:35:31.933 --> 00:35:38.373
Michelle Fern: I want to thank you for writing your book because it was just a fabulous read, and I think it's going to change some lives.
00:35:38.593 --> 00:35:43.313
Michelle Fern: I hope there's a series out there that's going to change yours by TV series.
00:35:43.333 --> 00:35:44.593
Michelle Fern: That would be such a great idea.
00:35:44.813 --> 00:35:45.253
Dr. Amy Attas: Thank you.
00:35:45.273 --> 00:35:46.453
Dr. Amy Attas: I really enjoyed our talk.
00:35:46.973 --> 00:35:54.133
Michelle Fern: Okay, everyone, again, the book is Pets and the City, True Tales of a Manhattan House Call Veterinarian by Dr.
00:35:54.193 --> 00:35:55.033
Michelle Fern: Amy Attas.
00:35:55.453 --> 00:35:57.433
Michelle Fern: This is an incredible book.
00:35:57.593 --> 00:35:58.713
Michelle Fern: You need to get it.
00:35:58.913 --> 00:35:59.513
Michelle Fern: I loved it.
00:35:59.653 --> 00:36:00.833
Michelle Fern: It's a fantastic book.
00:36:01.253 --> 00:36:04.773
Michelle Fern: I want to thank my cat crew who let me read.
00:36:05.073 --> 00:36:07.693
Michelle Fern: Thank you, Molly, Charlotte and Dennis.
00:36:08.053 --> 00:36:09.373
Michelle Fern: Thanks, of course, to Dr.
00:36:09.373 --> 00:36:17.633
Michelle Fern: Amy Attas for coming on Best Bets for Pets and writing this amazing book, Pets and the City, and for creating City Pets in Manhattan.
00:36:17.853 --> 00:36:21.093
Michelle Fern: And of course, thank you to everyone listening to Best Bets for Pets.
00:36:21.093 --> 00:36:22.313
Michelle Fern: I so appreciate it.
00:36:22.893 --> 00:36:28.473
Michelle Fern: And of course, this show would not be the same without the magic of Mark Winter, my producer.
00:36:28.833 --> 00:36:33.233
Michelle Fern: So, remember, you never know what we're going to have next on Best Bets for Pets.
00:36:33.913 --> 00:36:36.893
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00:36:37.373 --> 00:36:39.933
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